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bkball
173 Posts |
 Posted - 04/15/2015 : 08:10:39
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Looking at some of the posts about the high school baseball season this year, pros and cons, I see some complaints about coaches, politics etc. and wonder if the trend to bypass high school will become more prevalent.
I noticed one of the best, if not the best, high school baseball coaches ever in the state of Georgia resigned this season. It had me wondering if parents are paying 1K and more for their kids to play JV and Varsity baseball, why wouldn't they just start the travel season early and start playing as a team in March. I won’t say all, but most of the better travel teams coaching is far superior to what you get at the high school level. Like someone said in another post a lot of these coaches are just math or shop teachers and have no baseball experience at all. Some are swayed to play the kids whose parents volunteer the most, or might be staff members of the school etc and it hurts the team’s chances of being the best it can be.
On the other hand I understand playing for your high school has a lot of pride associated with it, everyone is talking about it at school and it seems to be more of a team effort opposed to travel baseball which sometimes turns into a way of trying to separate yourself from other players.
Travel coaches can make a living off coaching baseball without the head aches of teaching classes and having to do lesson plans and attend PTA meetings and I believe high school coaches don’t make very much for coaching baseball for the time they put in.
I can think of a few really good high school coaches in Georgia that are left and I am afraid when those guys retire the state of high school baseball could change dramatically unless something is done.
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 10:06:31
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I don't think bypassing high school baseball will become more prevalent. I think it's more than pride that gets these kids to come out for the team, it's about a sense of belonging while they are at school. Science Club, AV club, Band Geek, Jock, Princess Club....high school pretty much requires kids to assign themselves a role, an identity, a pack that makes you feel like you belong.
If the progression of baseball skills was all that was at stake I would agree that kids would bypass high school ball in favor of a longer travel ball season, but they are kids first and ball players second. Finding your nitch in high school is a rite of passage and they all have to go through it. |
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DecaturDad
619 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 11:29:09
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| The other thing that HS ball offers that travel can't is practice time. The kids walk out of school, change and practice. There is no driving to the team field. No need to even find a field. Most schools have one right on the property. My son leaves his gear in the baseball locker room. All he carries back and forth are his gloves. You can't beat that for convenience. And the easier you make it, the more chance they will do it :-) |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 12:05:18
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quote:
Originally posted by toprank
My son had a strange experience with his high school baseball team this season. He played a winter sport competed in the state tournament for that sport, so was about 2 weeks late getting out to baseball and the Varsity coach never evaluated him, just stuck him on JV. Long story short, he decided not to play and will probably not play for this coach ever.
Did he let the coach know that he wanted to play baseball prior to tryouts? Was the coach aware of him prior to him just showing up after his winter sport?
Either way, I don't find that particularly unusual. My thought is he would have been evaluated as a JV player and if he showed he is varsity material, he would have been called up during the season.
Although 2 weeks doesn't sound like much, a lot has happened on the baseball field in those 2 weeks. Tryouts occurred, evaluations were done, practices have been going on every day and they probably played a game or two. A player coming in that late becomes a little bit of an outsider and the coaches really don't have the time to do 2 weeks worth of evaluation for one player. I think even making the team and getting to prove yourself is a positive thing.
In my opinion, he should have stuck it out and given the coaches the opportunity to see him play. He may have been up on the varsity squad before he knew it. |
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DecaturDad
619 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 13:16:51
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quote:
Originally posted by toprank
My son had a strange experience with his high school baseball team this season. He played a winter sport competed in the state tournament for that sport, so was about 2 weeks late getting out to baseball and the Varsity coach never evaluated him, just stuck him on JV. Long story short, he decided not to play and will probably not play for this coach ever.
That is why my son gave up basketball. He was basically old he had a spot, but he knew it would interfere with the start of baseball, so he gave it up. I loved watching him play both sports, but I knew his heart was in baseball.
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 13:43:30
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quote:
Originally posted by toprank
My son had a strange experience with his high school baseball team this season. He played a winter sport competed in the state tournament for that sport, so was about 2 weeks late getting out to baseball and the Varsity coach never evaluated him, just stuck him on JV. Long story short, he decided not to play and will probably not play for this coach ever.
My guess is, that after quitting, he wouldn't have been invited to play for him in the future regardless of your son's desire.
I agree with bballman. Your kid was behind by a couple of weeks and, even if varsity material, needed to get into game shape. Something that he would get the reps to do at the JV level and then have the opportunity to get called up if he proved worthy.
Would you rather him get the nod to varsity, then sit the bench because he never gets the chance to catch up (or spend the next 3-4 weeks on the bench while catching up)?
Obviously, the passion to play baseball wasn't strong enough to deal with an inconvenience.
Curious, what grade is your son and did he play varsity last year? |
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BREAMKING
323 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 15:15:02
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| I like high school better than summer ball. I think the kids try harder in school ball. I think most high school coaches do it because they love it not because of the money. Now summer ball they might do it for the money. |
Edited by - BREAMKING on 04/15/2015 15:27:26 |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 15:56:00
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quote:
Originally posted by toprank
My son had a strange experience with his high school baseball team this season. He played a winter sport competed in the state tournament for that sport, so was about 2 weeks late getting out to baseball and the Varsity coach never evaluated him, just stuck him on JV. Long story short, he decided not to play and will probably not play for this coach ever.
I believe in the first 2 weeks he likely missed all the signs, all the call out plays, and they had already worked on a solid infield....was the coach suppose to just leave your son's spot vacant while he was finishing up another sport?
You said he was punished for playing another sport when in reality he was still allowed to join the JV team (which half the people on this board would be thrilled with!) I don't get your glitch, and I certainly don't understand why he would turn down JV ball. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 16:11:51
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I've been hearing since my son was 12 that it's going to become more prevalent. He's now 19. I guess it may happen someday, but I'll never notice. 
I heard a similar story to TopRank's, except it was around positions. The kid played hoops. He never got a look at pitcher and ended up being an afterthought position player who got about 10 ABs. Two things happened. 1) He didn't speak up and tell the coach he was a pitcher, 2) I guess the coach had decided who he thought his pitchers were for JV.
Anyway, he sucked it up, came back the next year and became one of their top relievers on JV for a year and Varsity for two years. Pitched in all but two of their playoff series as a Junior as they made a run to State.
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Edited by - AllStar on 04/15/2015 17:21:54 |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 20:53:24
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| How long did your son stay on JV before he quit the team? What grade is your son in? |
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Footballforsanity
14 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2015 : 21:15:22
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| Interesting post. I firmly believe if a player has the ability, he will find a place to play ball. Whether it's HS or Travel, if a scout can find a kid in Cuba he can certainly find them on a travel ball team in Charlotte... |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 10:01:52
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quote:
Originally posted by toprank
Should they have held a spot, heck yeah they should have. That is what good coaches do. What if 6 baseball players had been playing basketball, you think they would have stuck all 6 on JV without looking at them. NO way.
If your kid was a starter on Varsity last year, then absolutely a spot should have been held.
So in your mind, your kid was an absolute, no question, Varsity starter who should have had a spot held for him. If the coach saw it the same way as you did, a spot would have been held, I guarantee it. Exactly same thing that happened on our HS team this year. Deep basketball playoff run and a couple of prior year varsity starters on the basketball roster. While their names weren't posted on the varsity roster (after tryouts, while basketball team was still playing), there were two spots remaining to be filled and were, as soon as the team was eliminated from playoffs.
So if your kid is a no brainer for varsity, why didn't the coach know it? Has he seen your son play (JV last year, travel ball, school summer team)?
A couple of posters (myself included) asked what year your son is. A bit of history may fill in some blanks, but from your initial post and follow up, it sounds like there is a differing opinion (clearly) between what you see in your kid and what the coach sees.
Regardless, the one thing that I can take away is that he didn't have the passion and drive to work through this adversity with baseball. If he REALLY wanted to play HS varsity baseball, and he is good as you think, he would have dominated JV and proven his worth to varsity. By quitting, he didn't give himself the opportunity to prove the coach wrong, and in fact, likely confirmed to the coach that he did the right thing. Unfortunately, it's your son's loss. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 10:11:59
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quote:
Originally posted by toprank
CaCO3Girl on another post your wrote "The worst case scenario is that you accidentally agree to have your child play on a team that is FAR below their level Plus, they don't learn or get better."
This is exactly what I am talking about!
Lastly, One thing no one would say about me is I am is making my son out to be better than he is.
I was talking about travel ball, not HS ball. HS teams are a crap shoot...some teams are half D1 signed athletes and some teams think their 79mph pitcher is unbeatable because he throws so fast.
I also said if a kid expects to be recruited he better have a darn good answer for why he didn't play on his High School team...your kids answer will be "Well coach didn't evaluate me because I was playing basketball and he tried to send me to JV which I found totally unacceptable so I quit, I won't play for a coach who treats me like that"...can you imagine how well that conversation is going to go over?
I can tell you with total honesty there are parents of kids on this board that would play baseball in a tutu and lipstick if it meant they got to play...JV, V...whatever, if it was baseball they would do whatever it took. Your kid obviously doesn't appear to have that passion for the game, something to consider in the future. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 13:11:21
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quote:
Originally posted by BlazeTheDiamond
quote:
I also said if a kid expects to be recruited he better have a darn good answer for why he didn't play on his High School team...your kids answer will be "Well coach didn't evaluate me because I was playing basketball and he tried to send me to JV which I found totally unacceptable so I quit, I won't play for a coach who treats me like that"...can you imagine how well that conversation is going to go over?
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Obviously, he's not going to have that conversation. Back to the OP's thought, his player most likely will continue bball through the travel ball arena, and bypass HS. If he were to get recruited in that process, then it may never make a difference if he had played HS. Also, this parent would not let my son play in lipstick and a tutu just to get to play HS ball. If it came to that, he would gladly just continue with travel.
I feel that the great divide will ultimately boil down to $. Like others have said, there will always be nostalgia and convenience to playing HS. However, if the costs associated with both travel and HS teams continue to rise, I can see more families asking themselves, can we realistically support both. If my son gets greater exposure playing travel and it costs xxxx, and HS costs xxx (throw in a few more x's if needed, ha) , there can be a tipping point for some that HS isn't going to be worth it. I'll bet there are many parents out there that have already contemplated this.
Good point on the rising costs...and I think my son would wish to play baseball regardless of what he had to wear while doing it...he eventually got over HAVING to wear a cup...he would get over wearing a tutu if it meant he got to play. |
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bama21
278 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 14:06:32
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I say to each his own. As a parent you talk things over with your child and make a decision that seems best for your situation. We, as outsiders, will never know the whole story or more importantly, what the coach is thinking in his decision making. Luckily, baseball is one of the few sports where you have a better option (Travel Baseball)than High School baseball.
And who knows, with all the budget cuts to state governments and local schools, High School Baseball may become a thing of the past. If the school board had to cut an athletic program because of funding, then baseball would probably be one of, if not, the highest on the list. With the field maintenance costs and typically low patron turnout, compared to football and basketball, I'm sure most, if not all, High Schools are in the red when it comes to baseball. |
Edited by - bama21 on 04/16/2015 14:49:33 |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 14:14:09
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Looks like toprank had all his posts removed. Guess we won't be hearing back from him. Personally, I think the decision to quit was a little premature and immature. I am guessing that since the kid had never been evaluated by the coach, he was a freshman - or the coach would have already been familiar with him. And to expect to come in and play varsity is a little arrogant. You need to earn your spot in baseball. Nothing is given to you. I think the kid should have played some JV, showed the coaches what he was capable of and earned a spot on the varsity team. Unfortunately for this kid, he will have A LOT to overcome if he wants to play HS baseball in the future.
In terms of the OP, I don't think HS baseball is going anywhere in the near future. There are limited opportunities to play during the HS season. Those options cost money as well - maybe more than it costs to play HS. There will always be disgruntled players and families. But, there will always be WAY more kids who want to represent their school and play with their friends - regardless of how good or bad their HS team is. |
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HITANDRUN
436 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 14:15:55
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quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
[quote]
I also said if a kid expects to be recruited he better have a darn good answer for why he didn't play on his High School team...your kids answer will be "Well coach didn't evaluate me because I was playing basketball and he tried to send me to JV which I found totally unacceptable so I quit, I won't play for a coach who treats me like that"...can you imagine how well that conversation is going to go over?
this isn't the 80's. College colleges don't care about high school baseball like they used too, the first question they ask you is who do you play summer baseball with, and your GPA. I have heard it time and time again.
CaCo has your son been played hs baseball yet? have you watched a JV game? Most good Major 14U teams would run most JV teams off the field. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 15:35:45
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quote:
Originally posted by HITANDRUN
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
[quote]
I also said if a kid expects to be recruited he better have a darn good answer for why he didn't play on his High School team...your kids answer will be "Well coach didn't evaluate me because I was playing basketball and he tried to send me to JV which I found totally unacceptable so I quit, I won't play for a coach who treats me like that"...can you imagine how well that conversation is going to go over?
this isn't the 80's. College colleges don't care about high school baseball like they used too, the first question they ask you is who do you play summer baseball with, and your GPA. I have heard it time and time again.
CaCo has your son been played hs baseball yet? have you watched a JV game? Most good Major 14U teams would run most JV teams off the field.
I know of more than a handful of kids who have been asked about their ACT scores, Travel teams and high school teams...you have to admit there is a large pool of guys wanting to play college baseball. I would think one of the quickest ways to weed out character flaws would be to ask about the high school team and hear something from the players mouth about "I won't play for him", or "my high school team really isn't good so I don't play there"..or "well they wanted to put me on JV so I quit"...well that would help weed out the kids pretty fast. I don't think players are being asked what high school they play for to see what the reputation of the program is, I think they want to hear the kids response.
I would agree 100% that in a match up between 14u Major and the average JV team the 14u team wins hands down...but that is one of the many challenges of high school ball. High School ball is where the kid who got zero love from ECB/643/Titans/Dogs/Elite...etc...can be a total stud with his 75 mph fastball, or pop time of 2.5...High School Ball is where you don't have to be elite/major to play. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2015 : 16:47:58
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Let me make a point as to how this COULD be relevant. On a college team, you have a roster of 35 players (that's for D1. D2, D3, NAIA & JUCO could have a lot more). Of those 35 players, usually around 16 are pitchers. That leaves 19 position players. Once a starting 8 are determined, it is VERY tough to break into that 8. That leaves 11 position players as role players getting very little field time or ABs. Of the 16 pitchers, you may have 4 starters and say 5 relievers that are used more than the others. That leaves 7 pitchers who may see very few innings. That is a total of 18 kids on a college roster who will see limited play time. Are these guys needed by the coach? Yes they are!! If you do not play HS ball because you feel like you didn't get a fair shake - for what ever reason - what does that say about what your attitude might be when you get on the college team? Does a college coach want a kid that is going to quit or have a horrible, entitled attitude on his team if he doesn't earn one of the 8 starting positions or 9 highly used pitching spots? No, he isn't. He is going to want a kid that has a good attitude. He is going to want a kid that is willing to work harder to earn a starting spot if he doesn't earn it from the beginning. He is going to want a kid willing to get better while the seniors finish out their college career and be happy about being a starter their junior or senior year.
See, it's about perception. Every player on a college team is a VERY good player. Not every kid is going to be a starter. A coach wants kids who can work through that and contribute when the team needs them. He doesn't want a kid that is all about ME and if I don't get what I want, I'll take my ball and go home. Or sit on the bench and complain all the time and create a negative chemistry on the team. That's just the way it is.
My son's team had a pretty good player on his team last year. He was a solid reliever by the end of the year and was used pretty frequently. However, he wanted to be a 2 way guy and that just wasn't going to happen. He was the only kid on the team that got cut. When I asked my son about it, I asked why would XX get cut? He had a good year. His response was, "He was a bad teammate". He was always saying he could do better than the guys in the field.
That's why the reason you are not playing for your HS team matters, in my opinion. If you got cut because other kids were better or there was a backlog of kids in your position, that is not your fault. If a college coach sees you have tools, but still got cut from your HS team, that's not your fault and will probably be OK. If you quit your team because you didn't like the coach or you weren't getting play time, in my opinion, that is a red flag. |
Edited by - bballman on 04/16/2015 16:54:39 |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 07:47:21
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quote:
[i]
I would think one of the quickest ways to weed out character flaws would be to ask about the high school team and hear something from the players mouth about "I won't play for him", or "my high school team really isn't good so I don't play there"..or "well they wanted to put me on JV so I quit"...well that would help weed out the kids pretty fast. I don't think players are being asked what high school they play for to see what the reputation of the program is, I think they want to hear the kids response.
Let me play devils advocate for a minute, lets say your boys high school coach is a complete ass, knows very little about baseball is teaching the players the wrong things on the field. Would you still have your son play for that coach?  |
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mar1dxt
30 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 08:49:28
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| I guess my perception is different from being exposed to high school teams primarily in the North Fulton and East Cobb areas. The teams in general are well coach with coaching staffs that have a high level of playing and coaching experience. The level of play is high and the many of the players play summer ball on the travel teams referenced in this thread |
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knapper1
26 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 08:57:20
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I don't post very often on this forum but do read it every now and then. It's been helpful and we have gained information over the years..
We play in the North Fulton District and my son made his JV team as a freshman last year. After last year’s High School season we were thinking about playing summer ball but skipped it so he could focus on his fall sport. We missed most of the fall High School baseball workouts because of his High School fall sport. My son did not make the High School team this year. We were surprised for sure.
Was that because he wasn't good enough?? I guess the High School coaches thought that way. Were they not happy he wasn't at fall workouts or that he didn't play summer ball?? They will never say that but you never know the thinking or what politics are going on behind the scenes.
I do know of another top player who didn't make their team on another school. He throws in the low to mid 80’s and is on a top tier travel team. I don’t believe it was grade related but maybe it was his attitude or something that I’m not aware of.
We as a family talked about it and I kind of told him it's his decision to continue or not and also told him don't make this decision just because this High School didn't want you. I told him to try out for a summer team and see how that goes. My son tried out for several Travel Teams and everyone we tried out for wanted him and couldn't believe he’s not playing High School ball and these are some top Travel teams.
Sports in a costly endeavor for sure. I told my son it’s his decision if he wants to try out for his High School team next year or just play summer ball. I don’t plan on paying for both because the cost has gotten out of control. Plus we have the cost of his other sport. My son will continue to play two sports because that’s what he likes.
Kind of rambled there but that’s our High School story..
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bama21
278 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 09:13:11
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Should you play for your high school? Obviously, the answer is yes, if at all possible. With that said, is it absolutely necessary, I would say the answer is no. Travel baseball gives a kid unparalleled exposure and if your good enough, then I don't think a scout will care if you played for your high school team. However, you also should not quit because things are tough and maybe not too your liking. I would also not recommend staying if you are not benefiting in some way. If I were a scout, I equally would be concerned if your on the high school team but not playing. Why aren't you playing? That too, may be hard to answer.
Also, not every coach is a good coach and not every coach is going to have your kids best interest at heart. What one coach does not see in you, another may. So, switching high schools may be for the best, it that's an option. If it is not an option, then the kid is stuck in a bad situation and probably has little to no control over the outcomes. We would all like to believe that if a kid is good enough he would play, but that may or may not be the case. That remains in the coaches hands and I KNOW WE ALWAYS AGREE WITH THEIR DECISIONS, DON'T WE????
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knapper1
26 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 09:50:08
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We wouldn't switch High Schools. He has many friends there. My post was not to bash our High School baseball team it was to show that you can still play competitive ball even if your High School team doesn't want you. Next year we will see what he wants to do but I told him I'm only paying for two things, so it's two sports or it's two baseball seasons, High School and summer. Doubt he'll drop the other sport.
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 10:15:01
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quote:
Originally posted by 743
quote:
[i]
I would think one of the quickest ways to weed out character flaws would be to ask about the high school team and hear something from the players mouth about "I won't play for him", or "my high school team really isn't good so I don't play there"..or "well they wanted to put me on JV so I quit"...well that would help weed out the kids pretty fast. I don't think players are being asked what high school they play for to see what the reputation of the program is, I think they want to hear the kids response.
Let me play devils advocate for a minute, lets say your boys high school coach is a complete ass, knows very little about baseball is teaching the players the wrong things on the field. Would you still have your son play for that coach?
I know most of you haven't been through this. But we have and know A LOT of kids that are playing in college. When a coach recruits a player, he has on his recruiting face. Once you get on the team, it may be a completely different face he puts on. What are you going to do then? The rules for changing schools within the NCAA are very complicated. There are many kids that have changed schools thinking the grass is greener, only to find out that it is not so green once you get there. If you are lucky enough to get recruited by a college, you kind of get what you get. You can do all the due diligence and ask all the questions, but your actual experience could very well not meet up with what you were expecting. If you ran away from that in HS, how will you deal with it in college? Run again? Change teams every year until you find one that is completely comfortable? Just not that easy to do.
So, I guess I'm saying is yes. It is your HS. Play for the coach. If you have a HS coach that is a total jerk and you think he doesn't know what he is talking about or whatever, part of life lessons are learning how to deal with and overcome adversity. Help your kid deal with the coach and his attitude. Help him have a team comes first attitude and do whatever he can to be a positive influence.
When my son was in HS, he had a coach that wasn't really a jerk, but really wasn't a knowledgeable, seasoned coach. The kids on the team all knew he really didn't know what he was doing. He played anyway - because it was his high school's team. It never even entered his head that he didn't want to play for his HS. If I would have asked him if he wanted to leave to play for a better coach, he would have thought I was crazy!!
Sorry guys. I don't think anyone will be able to give me enough reasons to not play for the HS team. Are there extreme cases? Yes, but for the vast majority of cases, play for your HS team and learn how to overcome the adversity and deal with a coach that you don't think is the best coach or makes the best decisions.
And once again it is about perception. A recruiter will see a player's tools. If that recruiter sees the tools a player has, he will not care if you got cut from your HS team or that you are not playing for the HS team (unless you are not playing because of disciplinary reasons or an attitude problem - and recruiters will ask about that). Those decisions are out of the player's hands. Whether he stays on the team or decides to quit the team is totally in the players hands and the player may well be judged on that. Now, if your kid throws 95, it's probably something you don't need to worry about. If you are an average kid throwing 84-88, every little bit helps. Don't make the wrong impression. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2015 : 10:45:12
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quote:
Originally posted by 743
quote:
[i]
I would think one of the quickest ways to weed out character flaws would be to ask about the high school team and hear something from the players mouth about "I won't play for him", or "my high school team really isn't good so I don't play there"..or "well they wanted to put me on JV so I quit"...well that would help weed out the kids pretty fast. I don't think players are being asked what high school they play for to see what the reputation of the program is, I think they want to hear the kids response.
Let me play devils advocate for a minute, lets say your boys high school coach is a complete ass, knows very little about baseball is teaching the players the wrong things on the field. Would you still have your son play for that coach?
And let's say frogs had wings.....in this baseball hotbed the chances of a high school coach being a complete moron are slim to none because the jobs are coveted. Also, if the coach was as described I don't think College Scouts would be talking to the guy about his opinion on a player, and therefor parents would have had the coach ousted years ago.
But, for arguments sake, let's say he was teaching the wrong things on the field...I think my son would look at it like "been there done that"...I think most high level baseball kids at some point in time were with a coach, maybe a rec ball coach, that had them scratching their heads and thinking WOW this guy is way off!, BUT he still played his best for him, and did his best to accommodate the coaches wishes, even the weird ones, as long as he didn't feel it put him in danger. If the coach thinks the SS should do two complete circles around the base runner, clapping like a lunatic, prior to the pitch being thrown then that is just what the players have to do. (true story there)
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Could this be the trend in 5 to 10 years for HS
