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DeadHead
158 Posts |
 Posted - 08/14/2012 : 16:15:03
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| Wonder what peoples thought are on this. Is it at the offer and saying yes, or when money is put towards the team? What about if a coach offers a spot but is told player is going to other tryouts and coach says spot is players until taken? Do you just say yes and go to tryouts anyway? Heard of this going on alot this year. Just wondering other opinions on this. Can see it both ways. |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 16:33:17
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If you receive an offer and reply with a "yes", you have committed.
If you receive an offer and inform the coach that you are interested, but continuing to try out for other teams to entertain other offers, then you have not committed.
Not sure what you mean in your comment that the "spot is players until taken". Does that mean taken by anyone or just the player offered? If the former, then the coach has made a commitment to you and must keep that offer open until you decide what you want to do. If the latter, then really, neither of you have made a commitment and while you're seeking a better opportunity, he's seeking a better or the next best player to fill his opening. Either of you may win or lose in that case.
If you accept an offer (commit) unconditionally, and continue to try out for other teams with the expectation of reneging on your acceptance in favor of another offer, then you are going back on a commitment. A cardinal sin of travel ball in my book. |
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rippit
667 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 16:51:19
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You are offered a spot on a roster and are asked for a verbal commitment. You are most likely given some time to secure that spot with a non refundable deposit. When that date passes, the coach will attempt to fill your unsecured spot with someone ready to commit while you are still shopping around at your own risk.
You might come back later to inquire if there is still a spot available. Maybe there is. Maybe not.
The coach is trying to make sure he actually has a team. He can't rely on a bunch of maybes. In return, he should be able to deliver a team to all the other members of the team.
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DeadHead
158 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 17:25:28
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| Have an 8U starting travel ball this year so this is not an issue with us but have friends in older age grps that seem to be having this problem of players committing then leaving before giving any money. Just wondering if this was typical of travel ball since we are new to this beast!! |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 17:46:47
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I agree with intheknow 100%. If coach offers and you say yes, that is it. You shouldn't be looking around and trying out for other teams. If you are offered and you let the coach know you still have a possible interest in another team, there should be a reasonable time frame that the offer remains open. That should be discussed right then and there. The offering coach needs to move on to the next guy if it is going to be too long before you accept. Some coaches give you a couple of days, some a week. The longer the time, the less of a pool he will have to choose from so you need to be reasonable.
Bottom line, if you are offered and you say yes - it is a done deal in my book. |
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larryjr
46 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 20:46:32
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| ITK...on your cardinal sin. This silly season we had one parent tell us that their word was golden and once they committed "there was no turning back". That lasted all of 24 hours until they got another offer they decided to take. Then we had a family committed since April and all the way through our tryout, only to hear that they were at a private workout for another team a week later. When pressed they said they wanted to have options....offer pulled. It never ceases to amaze me how adults behave. Just be honest and have the adult conversation about your intentions so coaches know where they stand. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 21:22:40
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| Larry, it's a pure shame if you ask me. All these parents talk about how they want a coach that's going to be an example to their son. They complain about things being unfair and politics and how that is not what they want their kid to be exposed to. Then they do that kind of thing. It is a TERRIBLE example, if you ask me. They are teaching their kid that it is OK to basically lie. Or to give your word and then go back on it. How do they think their kid will act as they grow up. What if their kid promises their parent they will do something, or not do something and then does the opposite. It's OK because dad did it to the travel coach. It really bothers me. You should be true to your word. |
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neverquit
128 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2012 : 23:38:03
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| Im all for finding the best team for your kid. However once you leave dont come back. One parent committed to our team. Then listened to another coach spill and text us they were gone. That is fine. But when they found out the team carries a large roster they didnt like that and wanted to come back. Sorry |
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Crossroads
448 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 06:22:02
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I agree with in_the_know...verbal Yes is a committed response...I do understand the non-refundable deposit and I have tried to go that route but parernts will drag that out also if they are still going to other tryouts. It is a shame that everyone is looking for the greenier grass but most of the time the grass doesn't grow as green as they wished for.
To me once a broken promise their is know second chance with that family. If they did it once they will do it again, that is from first hand experience.
Coach the families that want to be there and don't worry on the one's who think they are to good for your team. In the end it is all about teaching and developing those kids and families who want to be there. |
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ramman999
241 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 07:23:49
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Yes is the commitment, the money/deposit is the execution of said commitment.
Now, if the parent is upfront about it (ie. tried out/trying out for multiple teams) and lets it be known prior then it's a little different, but perhaps not everyone is so forthcoming.
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4bagger
131 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 09:24:44
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Had a kid commit to our team and we were very happy. We wanted him and he was one of our top 4 or 5 kids. Then he took an offer to another team because they are, in his mind, a better team. He was their 12th choice. The kid they would take if nothing better came along.
I can't understand why a parent would want their kid to be somebodys last choice instead of somebodys top choice just because of the name on the front of the jersey.
If you commit-stay with that team.
That player will never play on any team I am a part of. Another post spoke about black listing kids. Well, here's one for my black list. |
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gasbag
281 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 09:32:16
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| It may be vogue to shop and prostitute your player to a variety of teams but at what price ? I'd rather teach my son that a "man's word is his bond". But then maybe I'm just old fashioned...... |
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loveforthegame25
448 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 10:08:19
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| Being involved in travel baseball for 8 years, ive learned no player is commited until a check in cashed and the player shows up at the practices. And even then they may be shopping around if they havent paid off the entire balance. |
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Crossroads
448 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 10:34:42
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| 4Bagger and gasbag...well said! |
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agent21
97 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 11:08:51
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| agree with you 4bagger but it took my son to point it out to me as we waited for an offer from one of the "top" teams who shuttle players up and down in the organization -- he said, "why would i want to play for a team that only wanted me at my very best but would "send me down" to a lower team in a heartbeat instead of trying to coach me and work through my struggles." he is right -- it is not about the team name your jersey sports. |
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Scorpions16U
8 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 11:44:59
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quote:
Originally posted by DeadHead
Wonder what peoples thought are on this. Is it at the offer and saying yes, or when money is put towards the team? What about if a coach offers a spot but is told player is going to other tryouts and coach says spot is players until taken? Do you just say yes and go to tryouts anyway? Heard of this going on alot this year. Just wondering other opinions on this. Can see it both ways.
Well my thoughts are if someone tells you yes they are commited then they should be commited... But in todays world best to get a contract in front of them and see if they are really commited. At this point if they sign they are commited and contract bound to the coach...If they refuse to sign at that time, that should answer your question... |
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4bagger
131 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 12:58:24
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Love what your son said Agent. He has his head on straight and is focused on how a coach should be. Good job raising that boy.
I'm going to show your post to my son. |
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readyforbaseball
23 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2012 : 14:20:44
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I had a boy that told me that he was committed and have a contract too. I got a call from the dad and the dad said that he has decided to go to another team. Then found out that the boy had a tryout the next nite as well.
quote:
Originally posted by Scorpions16U
quote:
Originally posted by DeadHead
Wonder what peoples thought are on this. Is it at the offer and saying yes, or when money is put towards the team? What about if a coach offers a spot but is told player is going to other tryouts and coach says spot is players until taken? Do you just say yes and go to tryouts anyway? Heard of this going on alot this year. Just wondering other opinions on this. Can see it both ways.
Well my thoughts are if someone tells you yes they are commited then they should be commited... But in todays world best to get a contract in front of them and see if they are really commited. At this point if they sign they are commited and contract bound to the coach...If they refuse to sign at that time, that should answer your question...
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Rocky
290 Posts |
Posted - 08/16/2012 : 07:51:52
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only thing i have learned over the years about travel baseball is until you see the cash,in your hand there are no commitments. I have seen checks bounce, then even sometimes players will up and leave.
"baseball is a metaphor for life." the good and the bad
You shop for a new job have some interviews verbally commit but when does that verbal commitment really count? They could fire you the next week. If another job offers you a better package you or the company might re-track your or their offer and move on? |
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Gwinnett
791 Posts |
Posted - 08/16/2012 : 08:54:44
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Rocky, very well put!
quote:
Originally posted by Rocky
"baseball is a metaphor for life." the good and the bad
You shop for a new job have some interviews verbally commit but when does that verbal commitment really count? They could fire you the next week. If another job offers you a better package you or the company might re-track your or their offer and move on?
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BatChipper
52 Posts |
Posted - 08/16/2012 : 17:08:28
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| Well put Rocky....we took our son to several workouts/tryouts and he made his commitment to a team. Now, all the coaches out there can get all tore up at this comment, but it's my responsibility, as a parent he is being taught how to play the game of baseball the right way and that the coach is "coaching" the game the right way and that he takes the team in the direction that he said he was. Example, my son played a major position for a team then about 3/4 through the season our coach told another kid that if he joined the team, that the certain major position my son was playing would be his. Know this for a fact. The other kid bragged to my son about taking his position. We finished out the year with that team and when the coach would ask, if my son was staying with the team next year? Well, we would smile and just say "yes". Now, did we commit to that team? Some would say "yes" others would have left when the coach had the other kid come on board but then my son would've been one of those kids, the coaches are talking about in the black list section of this forum. It goes both ways! |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 08/16/2012 : 20:42:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Rocky
only thing i have learned over the years about travel baseball is until you see the cash,in your hand there are no commitments. I have seen checks bounce, then even sometimes players will up and leave.
"baseball is a metaphor for life." the good and the bad
You shop for a new job have some interviews verbally commit but when does that verbal commitment really count? They could fire you the next week. If another job offers you a better package you or the company might re-track your or their offer and move on?
If you can't take someone for their word, then their word means nothing....ever.
So basically, you're saying that because someone may not be true to their word, that you aren't going to be true to yours. Pretty weak.
Rocky's right, baseball does reflect real life. And if we teach our children that their word mean nothing in baseball, then we're teaching them that same when it comes to real life. At what point do you teach your children that they're only as good as their word, and that without that, they have no integrity? Is the world perfect? No. Will it happen in ours and their lifetime that someone will go back on their word to them? Yes. Does that excuse them from remaining true to their word? It doesn't for my kid. |
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Coach Art
59 Posts |
Posted - 08/17/2012 : 10:03:42
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In all fairness, I think it would only be an issue if your son played the position better, if not moot point.
It's definitely not an easy decision for a coach to make, we try to always give the incumbent the opportunity to retain the spot but not at the cost of improving the team
quote:
Originally posted by BatChipper
Well put Rocky....we took our son to several workouts/tryouts and he made his commitment to a team. Now, all the coaches out there can get all tore up at this comment, but it's my responsibility, as a parent he is being taught how to play the game of baseball the right way and that the coach is "coaching" the game the right way and that he takes the team in the direction that he said he was. Example, my son played a major position for a team then about 3/4 through the season our coach told another kid that if he joined the team, that the certain major position my son was playing would be his. Know this for a fact. The other kid bragged to my son about taking his position. We finished out the year with that team and when the coach would ask, if my son was staying with the team next year? Well, we would smile and just say "yes". Now, did we commit to that team? Some would say "yes" others would have left when the coach had the other kid come on board but then my son would've been one of those kids, the coaches are talking about in the black list section of this forum. It goes both ways!
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Edited by - Coach Art on 08/17/2012 10:15:49 |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 08/17/2012 : 10:43:42
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quote:
Originally posted by BatChipper
Example, my son played a major position for a team then about 3/4 through the season our coach told another kid that if he joined the team, that the certain major position my son was playing would be his. Know this for a fact. The other kid bragged to my son about taking his position.
Total bs unless the coaches warned the team that they would be doing that. This isn't MLB. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 08/17/2012 : 11:08:15
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quote:
Originally posted by in_the_know
If you can't take someone for their word, then their word means nothing....ever.
At what point do you teach your children that they're only as good as their word, and that without that, they have no integrity? Is the world perfect? No. Will it happen in ours and their lifetime that someone will go back on their word to them? Yes. Does that excuse them from remaining true to their word? It doesn't for my kid.
intheknow, I couldn't agree with you more. Nothing more to be said than what you said above. Period. |
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SSBuckeye
575 Posts |
Posted - 08/17/2012 : 12:27:20
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quote:
Originally posted by bballman
quote:
Originally posted by in_the_know
If you can't take someone for their word, then their word means nothing....ever.
At what point do you teach your children that they're only as good as their word, and that without that, they have no integrity? Is the world perfect? No. Will it happen in ours and their lifetime that someone will go back on their word to them? Yes. Does that excuse them from remaining true to their word? It doesn't for my kid.
intheknow, I couldn't agree with you more. Nothing more to be said than what you said above. Period.
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Definition of commiting to a team
