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teddy41
421 Posts |
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Bully
49 Posts |
 Posted - 04/21/2010 : 19:42:09
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| I had a player do something like that last year and the umpire called him safe until the other coach complained that he did not slide and the umpire changed his call to out. Suprise the other coach was the assistant park director at that park. |
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oldschooldad
203 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2010 : 20:48:46
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Very impressive play, I must say.
However, most youth association do not allow jumping or leaving your feet to avoid a tag. The risk of injury is too great. |
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AA17Dad
211 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2010 : 20:52:59
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| I was thinking the rule said the runner had to slide and or avoid contact. I'd say he was safe. |
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op-o
41 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 08:36:22
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Boys, this is a college game. Very different rules than youth travel baseball.
The only questions should be if the catcher tagged him on the leg when he was going over. You really can't tell from the video. |
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teddy41
421 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 09:25:58
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| travel uses NFHS rules in most age groups, same as college |
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SpeedKills
106 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 09:46:57
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quote:
Originally posted by teddy41
travel uses NFHS rules in most age groups, same as college
They may but you have to slide if there is a play at the plate... |
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stanlewis
545 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 10:34:30
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| This video is all over the internet so a lot of your players are going to see it. Make sure they understand it is almost universally illegal in youth baseball through high school. By high school rules the only time you can jump over a fielder is if he is lying on the ground. You can never dive. Going over a fielder even if he does not have the ball is illegal. The illegal acts of the runner supersede obstruction. |
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Alter-Ego
802 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 10:40:02
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| It is also an ejection, if I am correct, like running over a C. The rationale behind it is that the players are wearing spikes, which can cause damage to another player if they are accidentally kicked while being jumped. It is never a practice I would condone. Looks flashy but not smart. |
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zwndad
170 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 11:48:51
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We had a similar play at third base about 3 years ago in a 12U game in GGBL League play. We were stunned. A kid leaped over our 3rd baseman to avoid a tag and landed on the base. It was really cool. We were really shocked when the umpire called the runner out AND ejected him. We were playing at the runner's home park, and we found out later that the umpire had warned the kid before, so apparently he did it a lot.
I've also seen it in USSSA tournament play (I think it was 12U at the time), and the runner was called safe.
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Edited by - zwndad on 04/22/2010 14:00:12 |
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coachdan06
433 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 12:59:48
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Stan is correct can not leap dive jump etc to avoid being out until NCAA or professional levels.
Even in NCAA you must slide at home plate is there is a play , can not do the Pete Rose - Ray Fossee move or you will be out then ejected from the game .
Safety. |
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teddy41
421 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 14:43:42
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coach are you saying there was not a play at the plate on this one?
sure looked like one was possible |
Edited by - teddy41 on 04/22/2010 20:33:00 |
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oldschooldad
203 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 15:00:06
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From USSSA rule book.
8.04.C Whenever a tag play is evident, a runner must slide or seek to avoid contact with the fielder and / or catcher.
Attempting to jump, leap, or dive over the fielder and / or catcher is not interpreted as seeking to avoid contact.
Malicious contact shall supersede all obstruction penalties.
Rule 8.04.C Penalty: The runner shall be called out and may be ejected from the game at the umpire’s discretion.
Rule 8.04.C Comment: When enforcing this rule, the umpire should judge the runner’s intent. If the umpire feels
that the contact was unintentional, then the runner should only be declared out. If the umpire feels that the contact
was intentional and / or malicious, then the runner should be declared out and ejected. |
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coachdan06
433 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2010 : 23:02:49
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quote:
Originally posted by teddy41
coach are you saying there was not a play at the plate on this one?
sure looked like one was possible
My error !
I mean to say that the runner must avoid physical contact aside from sliding.
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clg003
79 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2010 : 10:33:32
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| Earlier in the year in Ellijay in 13u a player tried to jump over a player to avoid contact in the middle of the basepath and the fielder caught a knee to the temple and was knocked out cold and left in an ambulance. It was a horrible sight to see and yes it a very dangerous move and players should be called out an ejected to avoid such injuries. |
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billbclk
164 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2010 : 15:05:20
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| This is VERY dangerous for the runner and catcher. I believe the GGBL banned this a few years ago after the last time a player jumped a catcher. |
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clg003
79 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2010 : 11:47:43
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| Spikes to the shin vs. being Tim Tebowed on the field, waking up asking did we win and leaving in an ambulance. Sorry call me crazy but I dont see any comparison whatsoever. |
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ronicard
117 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2010 : 10:44:46
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Diving over a fielder is the dangerous part here, but the ejection is NOT an automatic ejection. If you read that rule, you see it's the Umpire's discretion on whether or not to eject a runner. If the kid put either of the players at risk, then I would agree with the ejection.
But, I've seen a similar play happen at the plate before and the kid ended up getting ejected and later, so did the coach for arguing the ejection and I STILL think the umpire was wrong. The catcher was receiving a throw from right field and had gone to both knees to block what was a low and skipping throw. But, he was set up about 2 - 3 feet in front of the plate, out towards the pitcher's mound and on the field of play. He blocks the ball, picks it up off the ground and lunges back and to his left to get into the basepath to try and tag the runner. The runner does a head first dive but twists his body in the air so that his feet are towards the 3rd base dugout and this body is essentially at a right angle to the base path as he comes in. The catcher actually got there late and the runner never actually went over him, except possibly his hands going over the catcher's mitt and tag, but it didn't even look like that occured from the point of view I had.
The runner slides past the plate, but drags his hand across it and the catcher never even comes close to touching him. But the umpire ruled the player out for diving over the runner AND he ejected him. In my opinion, not only should the player have been safe and not ejected, this is absolutely how I teach my players that I want them to slide to avoid a tag. It's the most reliable way to get in safely, and it's the safest for both the runner and the catcher.
On a side note, when did sliding head first become such a no-no to so many baseball people? The only major leaguer who is even remotely close to the top of the leading basestealers of all time who I can think of as a feet-first slider was Ty CObb. And he only did it because he was a mean SOB who would sharpen his spikes near the first base line before the games as a warning to anyone who stayed on the bag when he got there (ie...you're going to get spiked).
And, let's not downplay getting spiked. My brother had to get 6 stitches in the top of his feet when he was spiked by a sliding runner at 2nd base when he played as a 14-year old. We didn't have to call an ambulance, but we had to put him straight into the car and take him to the emergency room, so same difference.
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Edited by - ronicard on 04/29/2010 14:07:21 |
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you dont have to slide and u can jump
