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O-fer
16 Posts |
 Posted - 09/13/2009 : 19:52:43
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| Can someone explain to me how kids can play on more than 1 or even 2,3 teams per year. I understand how you can do it at multiple age levels but how do you do it within the same age group. Im sure I could look at all the various association websites but its so much easier just putting it out there. I am espicially curious of the pitfalls associated with doing this..... |
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Alter-Ego
802 Posts |
Posted - 09/13/2009 : 23:31:23
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| One option is to play for different teams across different sanctioning bodies (play for one team for USSSA tournaments, but play for 1 or 2 others for Triple Crow, Nations Baseball, or USTBA). It is hard to navigate, but not impossible. |
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12uCoach
357 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 08:49:25
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Don't think yearly, think weekly. There are players who agree to play for different teams during different tournaments. A kid could play for the Yankees in USSSA tournaments, Orioles in Triple Crown, Rays in the AAU State Tournament, and go to Cooperstown with all 3 and the Red Sox on 4 different weekends.
Problems occure when the kid does not live up to hype on one of the teams, or parents of displaced weaker player pitch a fit.
We have brought in pitchers before, and during off weekends have had some of my players help out others becuase of injury. |
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baseballpapa
1520 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 08:52:57
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I don't know the answer to this and can only respond to my own personal circumstances. My grandson guest played for a team he played for prior to his current team that was short of players for a tournament at All Tournament Players Park and his current team was not playing that weekend. This was a one shot deal and we had a release and re-release signed by all Coaches and had it approved by Triple Crown prior to playing.
I also can state that the Bandits 10U finished up late June this year and several of our players that still wanted to play baseball guest played on teams throughout the Atlanta area. What is the problem with the kids playing all the baseball they can play anyway.
The pitfalls would certainly include being declared ineligible for your real team if you do not follow the proper steps. |
Edited by - baseballpapa on 09/14/2009 08:58:59 |
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AA17Dad
211 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 08:58:08
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This time of year rosters don't mean anything.
You could play on a different team every week. |
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bmoser
1633 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 10:41:57
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I can think of 3 scenario's:
- year round player
- fill-in player
- team jumper
Year round & fill-in: Jan-July 4th, my son played on a travel league team. In this area, we have GGBL, LBL, NWGA, & the 400 League. His Coach shut the team down for the rest of the year after the end-of-season league championship ended. That was a league-only team.
Then, my son wanted to play Summer tourneys. We joined the 2nd team, and played w/ them July and August. When school began, he wanted to play Fall travel ball, so joined a 3rd travel league team for a light Fall schedule because neither of the prior two teams played Fall (due to football). During this light Fall schedule, some friends were building a new team, and needed my son for fill-in for a couple of tourneys, so that was the 4th team he played for in 2008.
Team jumper & fill-in: This occurs when the Dad and/or player are dissatisfied with his current team and jumps to a new team mid-season, or between seasons. This player may also fill-in for a few teams to try them out as they search for a new team.
Downside of year round baseball are burn out and injury. Downside to playing on multiple teams is that you need to properly navigate tourney promoters roster rules to avoid eligibility issues.
Generally speaking, moving from team to team in Fall (August 1st till Jan 1st) is easy to do, but it becomes complex to do during the Spring/Summer season, so I've always avoided it.
I'll let others discuss downside of filling in, and team jumping.
quote:
Originally posted by O-fer
Can someone explain to me how kids can play on more than 1 or even 2,3 teams per year. I understand how you can do it at multiple age levels but how do you do it within the same age group. Im sure I could look at all the various association websites but its so much easier just putting it out there. I am espicially curious of the pitfalls associated with doing this.....
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O-fer
16 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 14:22:17
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| Thanks for the great responses so far.....and what I meant by "pitfalls" was more to do with the different sanctioning bodies than anything else. I was just wondering how kids are can be on multiple rosters for the same age group within the same body ie. USSSA. I got on the USSSA website last night after posting the question and they were pretty clear on what was legal but I am pretty sure kids play for more than one team in the same year. My son is no different than anyother little boy, he would never be considered a "hired gun" he just loves to play sports...so I wanterd to make sure if the team he plays for is off on a pirticular weekend and he is invited to play with some of his friends he doesnt get ruled ineligable for something stupid. |
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teddy41
421 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 15:15:10
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| until a roster is frozen you can play on as many usssa teams as you want at the same time. once it becomes frozen you have to decide to stay on it or off of it. another misconception is that a major player can not play on a AAA or AA tourney team. The fact is the team is ranked as major/aaa or aa not the player |
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TAZ980002
831 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 15:43:47
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quote:
Originally posted by teddy41
another misconception is that a major player can not play on a AAA or AA tourney team. The fact is the team is ranked as major/aaa or aa not the player
This is not a misconception. Several players from our team last year were not allowed to play with AA/AAA teams after we disbanded our 10u Major USSSSA roster. |
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bmoser
1633 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 16:16:14
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On USSSA rules and their enforcement...
When the Grip (Major 10u team from last year) disbanded, we wanted to pick up some Grip players to finish out our AA season with us, and a USSSA official we asked said we could not due to the 2-level drop.
Weeks later, we were in a AA sub-state tourney championship game, and learned our opponents pitcher played for a Major team during the same season, so we protested...and won. We also learned the same team (who we were beating at the time of the protest) were AAA! Why did USSSA allow a AAA team to enter a AA Sub State? The 2 AA teams this AAA team eliminated earlier that day didn't catch it.
Also, it is untrue that to play in a State tourney, you must qualify in a sub-state. State Directors can, and have made exceptions.
Lastly, it is untrue that you have to qualify to play in a World Series. 3 teams in our World Series never qualified.
USSSA's on-line rosters all have a disclaimer stating the on-line roster is not the official roster. This means we are all flying blind and only the Great Oz behind the curtain can send Dorothy home...or not.
quote:
Originally posted by teddy41
until a roster is frozen you can play on as many usssa teams as you want at the same time. once it becomes frozen you have to decide to stay on it or off of it. another misconception is that a major player can not play on a AAA or AA tourney team. The fact is the team is ranked as major/aaa or aa not the player
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 16:26:56
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| FYI, a roster is frozen when a team qualifies for a post season tournament/world series. If you are on that roster at that time, you must be released by your current team to be able to play for another team in a USSSA tournament. The qualifying team can only make, I believe, 3 roster changes once it is frozen. So, if your coach adds or subtract three other players, you may be stuck with that team and not be able to play with any other. Just be careful when doing this. |
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ljames
48 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2009 : 17:45:28
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teddy41 is correct. Since you are speaking about USSSA, here is the official excerpt from the rule book.
Rule 3.11 Comment: A player may legally appear on multiple Official Online Rosters in the same age division regardless of classification(s) until such time one of the rosters the player appears on in the age division becomes frozen. From the freeze date forward, the player may only appear on the frozen team’s Official Online Roster in that age division unless released pursuant to these rules.
Here is how a roster becomes frozen.
3.09 Qualified Teams:
3.09.A When a team qualifies (is awarded a berth for a State Championship and / or World Series) prior to April 1st of the current season (whether the team accepts the berth or not), the team’s Official Online Roster shall become frozen on April 1st regardless of the date the roster is physically frozen in the USSSA online system.
3.09.B When a team qualifies (is awarded a berth for a State Championship and / or World Series) after April 1st of the current season (whether the team accepts the berth or not), the team’s Official Online Roster shall become frozen immediately at the qualifying event regardless of the date the roster is physically frozen in the USSSA online system.
3.09.C When a team qualifies (is awarded a berth to the Elite World Series) at a Super NIT event (whether the team accepts the berth or not), the team’s Official Online Roster shall become frozen immediately at the Super NIT event regardless of the date the Super NIT event is played or the date the roster is physically frozen in the USSSA online system. |
Edited by - ljames on 09/14/2009 20:26:55 |
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whits23
596 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2009 : 10:26:16
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JC..i would be curious who did not allow them to play? If it was a local director trying to keep teams from loading up for a non sanctioned tourney maybe so but in a real tournament they cannot enforce that.
Players can play at any level at anytime unless frozen. The team makes the player ranking not vice versa.
I played in AA and Major NIT tourneys last year and full disclosure was made. Now i am willing to admit i could be wrong but unless Lomax makes a return to straighten me out i stand by it. |
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TAZ980002
831 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2009 : 12:18:39
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I don't remember what TD it was but it happened more than once with more than one of our players. It's possible that it was because our roster was frozen after the Super NIT in March but at the time these players tried to join other teams, we had disbanded our USSSA roster and were playing TC, Nations and USTBA.
I think it's a shame that the TD or USSSA (or both) would not consider that the players' former team was no longer together as USSSA goes and cut them some slack. It's not like any one player is going to change the level of play for any given team. The player may be able to have a strong impact in one game if he is a solid pitcher but otherwise he can only bat once through the lineup and play one position at a time. These kids just wanted to play ball and were denied the opportunity by the TD. That's the shame of it. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2009 : 12:37:15
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Whit, I can't quote a rule number, but I remember hearing that if 4 or more players from a previous team get together to form a new team, that team must be classified as the same as their previous team.
ljames, way to come up with the rules. I would also add to all of you, be very careful with this. A couple of years ago, we entered a tournament very early in the year. We knew we did not have our complete roster as several kids were playing school ball and were not joining us till after that. We did not do real well in the tournament. Got knocked out in the first round. Wound up in 5th place or something like that. Top two teams were awarded berths. Well, turns out three teams who finished ahead of us already had berths and the qualifying berth was handed down to us. We had no idea. USSSA never notified us. Head coach was making roster changes months later and got locked out. When he called USSSA, they then notified us that we had qualified during this tournament. We could make no further changes to the roster even though we had a number of kids on the team who weren't on it at that time. We could not reject the bid or do anything to get out of the situation. We wound up not playing anymore USSSA tournaments that year.
Just saying, you don't always know when you qualify and get your roster frozen. Also, once the roster is frozen, you can only make, I believe, three changes. After that you are done. USSSA will not budge on this. |
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bmoser
1633 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2009 : 14:12:57
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problem is that you cannot see the dates that teams "qualified" nor can you see the dates players were added or dropped. Only usssa tourney director has access to that info.
quote:
Originally posted by bballman
FYI, a roster is frozen when a team qualifies for a post season tournament/world series. If you are on that roster at that time, you must be released by your current team to be able to play for another team in a USSSA tournament. The qualifying team can only make, I believe, 3 roster changes once it is frozen. So, if your coach adds or subtract three other players, you may be stuck with that team and not be able to play with any other. Just be careful when doing this.
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whits23
596 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2009 : 15:22:23
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| Forming a new team is different from playing with another team and it could be some state directors try to overrule national rules. |
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Multiple Teams ?? How.....
