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Baseballrocks123
6 Posts |
 Posted - 04/02/2016 : 20:59:25
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Kid is 9 and doing travel ball but every game they get destroyed 1-20. Currently they are 0-12. Thinking of taking kid off the team. I don't see any positives to it and they are scheduled to go to mid June.
Thoughts. |
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BamaDad
188 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 06:45:49
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| My son, at 10, played up last year on an 11U AA team. He was given the option of being the 11th man on a AAA 11U team in the organization or the 1st player on the AA team. I chose the AA team. This team was comprised mostly of players who were leaving rec ball for the first time. The team went 1-49. Midway through the season, I had your same thoughts. However, my son had an opportunity to play every position on the field on this team and gain valuable experience. Best of all, he developed a strong dislike for losing that is instilled in him today. In the end, I made it about what was best for him and not my feelings about the team's record. |
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RoamingCF
77 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 08:22:04
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A few comments:
1. That is tough, in fact, it sucks. At some level, however, you jumped in (financially, schedule-wise) with other families. Walking away (even if you paid your piece), disrupts 9 other kids/families, and in my opinion, it should part of the consideration.
2. At no point are 10-12 families ever happy. Winning teams, losing teams, .500 teams. No matter the record, there will be a frequent undercurrent of drama. Every year, you will have some reason to question "why" you stay...
3. You said nothing about levels, types of tourneys, etc. You can find low level tourneys, maybe there is some opportunity to reduce competition (though this sounds like s bad situation).
Other families must feel similarly - can you make a "team" decision to make some changes in the best interest of the kids? |
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hshuler
1074 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 08:48:45
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| You may not like my answer but losing is not a reason to pull your kid off of a team. How would you explain that to your son? |
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sebaseball
101 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 13:19:31
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Couple of things for me:
1) My view at that age is that player development is way, way, way ahead of team achievement. I'm not saying that you don't try to win, but the focus and measure of success is in skill development and not the scoreboard. If your son is in a positive environment where the coach is good to the boys and is teaching them the proper fundamentals, then stick with it and recognize "success" as your son showing improvement. Once you hit 12 or 13 years old, as long as the fundamental skills are in place, you can then start turning the focus toward winning and what it takes to do so. If it's not a good environment where the kids are being yelled at and berated or expected to live up to unrealistic expectations, then that's a whole different conversation and worth leaving immediately.
2) Provided the enviornment & coaching is fine, leaving a team at this point could put the rest of the team in jeapordy. You jump ship and others may follow and then the team is done. It could be a decision that impacts 10 or more other young men. You committed to playing and should honor your commitment. Use it as a good learning experience for your son to see that you continue to work hard when things aren't going your way. Additionally, the vast majority of teams are already in place, so unless your son is a stud, your options will be quite limited and your son will most likely be in the back of the line on a new team.
That's my take anyway.
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TaxiMom
149 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 13:25:54
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Is your kid learning new skills? Getting a lot of playing time? At this age, IMHO, it's not about winning and losing, it's about development.
On the other hand, no kid likes to get blown out in every game. Is the coach signing them up for tournaments that are clearly above their level? If that's the case, talk to the coach and see if he'd consider playing in lower level tournaments, to give the boys a chance to feel some success. |
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Baseballrocks123
6 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 13:55:56
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| So Bamadad did that 1-49 team stay together the next year and turn the corner or did it fall apart? |
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BamaDad
188 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 19:05:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Baseballrocks123
So Bamadad did that 1-49 team stay together the next year and turn the corner or did it fall apart?
BBall, the team fell apart. Parents had no confidence in the coach's ability to reach the kids. However, we got out of the experience what I had hoped for and that was my son's getting the opportunity to develop with lots of PT and playing multiple positions. He hated losing and wondered why I let him play on this team as opposed to the other one. I reminded him that he would have been stuck in RF and batting 11th. He realized which was best for him in the end. |
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TAZ980002
831 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2016 : 22:11:04
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| In my opinion, if he is not having fun and getting better, pull him from the team. It is a waste of time and money. |
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ABC_Baseball
90 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 08:14:37
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It is a hard situation, but I just think of it as "paying your dues." During the rec ball years we switch parks without moving and had to sit out an all star year. The new park had some really strong kids and my son was a big contributor to the success the all star coach had during the regular season (Champs, no losses) and end of season tournament (Champs, 1 loss only). That being said, he couldn't play all stars and we found a tournament team for him to play on during the summer.
Overall there was not a lot of success that summer and we didn't know any of the other families. It was an opportunity to keep playing and developing. The coach I still see every so often and he was a good guy with some good practice habits. Since then, we have been on travel teams that were just Ok during our best years. My son has made some good friends and we have met some nice people that we will stay in touch with years after travel ball is done. The entire time he has been growing as a player.
We have played some major tournaments/teams and given up some big numbers while not scoring much. That being said, I don't see any real difference between the skill level of my kid and top players on major teams. Sure, all kids are different and have a unique set of strengths and weaknesses. As long as you can see your kid's improvement from season to season or month to month, it's ok. Mine does hate losing too. You can see it on his face at the end of games. Each year is a new chance to improve your situation. I personally have built some good relationships and wouldn't pull my kid as there are too many other folks counting on our participation.
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mdschert
47 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 08:23:58
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| My son was on a team like that at 9u, we won one game all season. We only had one family leave because of losing. Funny - the son's batting average was .071 |
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unitedballers
29 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 08:58:08
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| My advice...you have many teaching tools at your disposal 1)too many kids cannot handle adversity AT ALL. A losing season or three can be VERY beneficial 2)teaching kid's to finish what they started can help promote a great work ethic later in life 3)use this time so that he can refine his craft 4)lead by example |
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twodown22
9 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 09:41:24
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| This is all dependent on the circumstances. If there isn't much development, meaning kids are stuck in one position, daddy ball decision making, subpar coaching. I don't see anything wrong with making a change as a parent. Alot of times you join these teams who say all the right things and a year goes by and you kid is not any better. Lessons etc as great but nothing beats in game reps to learning. If he isn't learning or growing you have to move on. |
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BamaDad
188 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 10:05:16
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quote:
Originally posted by unitedballers
My advice...you have many teaching tools at your disposal 1)too many kids cannot handle adversity AT ALL. A losing season or three can be VERY beneficial 2)teaching kid's to finish what they started can help promote a great work ethic later in life 3)use this time so that he can refine his craft 4)lead by example
Yes, all of that is true. However, it our case it wasn't. First of all, the kids need to have the same mindset. If you have kids out there only because their parents want to "brag" that their son plays travel ball, then that's a problem. If some kids only want to goof around and the coach allows it, that's a problem. If you have kids that are still learning how to catch a fly ball at 11U, then that's a problem. I always use sports with my kids to teach "life lessons." Sometimes, the lesson is memorizing the Serenity Prayer.... |
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bfriendly
376 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 10:16:57
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quote:
Originally posted by ABC_Baseball
It is a hard situation, but I just think of it as "paying your dues." During the rec ball years we switch parks without moving and had to sit out an all star year. The new park had some really strong kids and my son was a big contributor to the success the all star coach had during the regular season (Champs, no losses) and end of season tournament (Champs, 1 loss only). That being said, he couldn't play all stars and we found a tournament team for him to play on during the summer.
Overall there was not a lot of success that summer and we didn't know any of the other families. It was an opportunity to keep playing and developing. The coach I still see every so often and he was a good guy with some good practice habits. Since then, we have been on travel teams that were just Ok during our best years. My son has made some good friends and we have met some nice people that we will stay in touch with years after travel ball is done. The entire time he has been growing as a player.
We have played some major tournaments/teams and given up some big numbers while not scoring much. That being said, I don't see any real difference between the skill level of my kid and top players on major teams. Sure, all kids are different and have a unique set of strengths and weaknesses. As long as you can see your kid's improvement from season to season or month to month, it's ok. Mine does hate losing too. You can see it on his face at the end of games. Each year is a new chance to improve your situation. I personally have built some good relationships and wouldn't pull my kid as there are too many other folks counting on our participation.
A great question as many folks have this same issue Baseballrocks.
So much of this^^^^^^^ applies to us as well. This whole travel ball thing is new to all of us at some point and we all have to make decisions. Stay or go? Sounds simple, and I think it is so long as the reason(s) for either decision are the right ones.
If your son is not in a positive and productive environment get him out. But I agree losing may just be a case of playing above overall Team Level. If he is having fun and Being Developed as a Player and young man, stay.
Last year we played AAA but were a mediocre AA team at best. We suffered the pain from playing above our level. We won a few games, but lost most and Never saw a Championship game; seldom a championship bracket . We were one of the teams that USSSA dropped down to AA, as it was appropriate
A Commitment is made by both sides......If either side holds up their end, the other should as well |
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turntwo
955 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 10:33:56
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quote:
Originally posted by twodown22
This is all dependent on the circumstances. If there isn't much development, meaning kids are stuck in one position, daddy ball decision making, subpar coaching. I don't see anything wrong with making a change as a parent. Alot of times you join these teams who say all the right things and a year goes by and you kid is not any better. Lessons etc as great but nothing beats in game reps to learning. If he isn't learning or growing you have to move on.
VERY good points, and what I was going to post... The lack of success has to boil down to 1 or 2 things...
1. Level of play? Is coach's ego, or the 'stud player' dads' ego calling the shots to play above that of what the team is truly capable of? (Meaning you're a AA team, trying to play the AAA or Major circuit?)
or
2. Is this a daddy/buddy ball situation where coach offered the all to common 'coach speech' in offering you/your son a spot on the team and telling you EVERYTHING you wanted to hear, yet pigeon holing coach's son, and his buddy's kids in prime positions come hell or high water, in terms of wins/losses? And in the mean time, coach isn't offering ANY great instruction during practices...???
quote:
Originally posted by BamaDad
First of all, the kids need to have the same mindset. If you have kids out there only because their parents want to "brag" that their son plays travel ball, then that's a problem. If some kids only want to goof around and the coach allows it, that's a problem. If you have kids that are still learning how to catch a fly ball at 11U, then that's a problem...
COMPLETELY agree with this comment too! (Are we on the same team-- assuming you're referring to how your team is now-- haha)! |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 13:34:58
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He's 9 and I suggest you be VERY careful. Have you seen the movie Trouble with the curve? Long story short there is a high school player in that movie that KNOWS he is the best out there, will be drafted high, and is just awesome. He charges for his autographs and dad is totally on board with his sons huge ego and swelled head. This is the worst case scenario for any coach, a kid who knows they are good and makes sure everyone else knows it in an unsportsmanlike manner.
I gather you feel your son is better than the other players on this team. Okay, so you leave the team and next year when his team when his team looses 3 games in a row and your son looks at you and says "dad, I'm too good for this team lets Gina another one"....what are you going to say to him?
I didn't do my homework one year and commited my son to a team before it was close to being complete...it was filled out with all star rec kids, want to talk about BAD! Did I think of pulling him, yes, did he ask to be pulled, yes, but he played out the entire season with them because he/I said he would. It was a season full of error after error and my son played 1B, SS, pitcher, catcher, batted clean up....he got an amazing amount of reps and he used that to find a different team in July.
As far as I'm concerned it's about commitment and what you want to teach your child. If your kid turns into an uncoachable megalomaniac you will have only yourself to blame. |
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Baseballrocks123
6 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 15:12:22
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Team is doing AA tournaments. It's basically the Rec Allstar team from 8u kid pitch. My kid isn't one of the best on the team, they all make errors but we just don't have any pitching. And they get stuck in the field watching the pitcher walk the bases loaded and then throw wild pitches to bring the runs home, and other players just stand there and go into zombie mode then ball finally gets hit and they make an error.
It's just sucking the life out of the whole family.
Thanks for all the feedback. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 16:12:43
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In my opinion, you made the commitment for the year, you should honor it. It teaches your kid the value of commitment and honoring your word - which I think is VERY important. When my son was around 8, he played on a rec team that did not win a game during the whole season. Played in the after season tournament, won the first game and lost the next. We still talk about it. Team name was the Brewers. The next year he played on the Brewers again, different coach. That team won the league championship. We still refer to those two teams as the good Brewers and the bad Brewers. The bad Brewers coach was horrible. I mean he knew nothing about baseball. But, we never even considered leaving the team. I worked with my son a lot, just the two of us.
There are more baseball lessons to learn than just what goes on on the field. There's a lot that goes on between the ears as well. Learning to deal with failure and losing is one of them. There will always be losses. If you are one of the best hitters around, you will fail at least 6 times out of 10. No matter how good you are, you will make errors. No matter how good a pitcher you are, you will give up runs and lose games. Why not make the best out of this situation. Work with your son on the side. Teach him how to deal with failure and still have fun. Do your best to help him keep his head up and learn the value of commitment. One season of losing is not going to kill your kid. Teaching him the lesson of going back on your word because the situation is difficult is one that could last a lifetime. JMHO... |
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BamaDad
188 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2016 : 16:54:11
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quote:
Originally posted by turntwo
quote:
Originally posted by twodown22
This is all dependent on the circumstances. If there isn't much development, meaning kids are stuck in one position, daddy ball decision making, subpar coaching. I don't see anything wrong with making a change as a parent. Alot of times you join these teams who say all the right things and a year goes by and you kid is not any better. Lessons etc as great but nothing beats in game reps to learning. If he isn't learning or growing you have to move on.
VERY good points, and what I was going to post... The lack of success has to boil down to 1 or 2 things...
1. Level of play? Is coach's ego, or the 'stud player' dads' ego calling the shots to play above that of what the team is truly capable of? (Meaning you're a AA team, trying to play the AAA or Major circuit?)
or
2. Is this a daddy/buddy ball situation where coach offered the all to common 'coach speech' in offering you/your son a spot on the team and telling you EVERYTHING you wanted to hear, yet pigeon holing coach's son, and his buddy's kids in prime positions come hell or high water, in terms of wins/losses? And in the mean time, coach isn't offering ANY great instruction during practices...???
quote:
Originally posted by BamaDad
First of all, the kids need to have the same mindset. If you have kids out there only because their parents want to "brag" that their son plays travel ball, then that's a problem. If some kids only want to goof around and the coach allows it, that's a problem. If you have kids that are still learning how to catch a fly ball at 11U, then that's a problem...
COMPLETELY agree with this comment too! (Are we on the same team-- assuming you're referring to how your team is now-- haha)!
I wouldn't wish that experience on anyone. That was last year though. We are in an awesome situation now. Bottom-line, I was able to teach a lot of life lessons from that experience and he has a greater appreciation for his team now. |
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Bravemom
204 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2016 : 05:58:40
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No not ok to pull kid unless it is an abusive situation. Good opportunity to teach life lesson...when things get tough (in life) you don't bail. Especially when you have other families who you would impact.
This is 9u, correct? Still lots of baseball and they are just learning to pitch. You sound like a newbie travel parent. Everybody likes to win, but a lot of people don't know how to lose. Bigger picture...is son developing? Getting reps? Learning fundamentals?
Mix in some lower level tourneys... I have seen single A tourneys. Helps with their confidence.
See the bigger picture. |
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Bravemom
204 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2016 : 06:01:20
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quote:
Originally posted by bballman
In my opinion, you made the commitment for the year, you should honor it. It teaches your kid the value of commitment and honoring your word - which I think is VERY important. When my son was around 8, he played on a rec team that did not win a game during the whole season. Played in the after season tournament, won the first game and lost the next. We still talk about it. Team name was the Brewers. The next year he played on the Brewers again, different coach. That team won the league championship. We still refer to those two teams as the good Brewers and the bad Brewers. The bad Brewers coach was horrible. I mean he knew nothing about baseball. But, we never even considered leaving the team. I worked with my son a lot, just the two of us.
There are more baseball lessons to learn than just what goes on on the field. There's a lot that goes on between the ears as well. Learning to deal with failure and losing is one of them. There will always be losses. If you are one of the best hitters around, you will fail at least 6 times out of 10. No matter how good you are, you will make errors. No matter how good a pitcher you are, you will give up runs and lose games. Why not make the best out of this situation. Work with your son on the side. Teach him how to deal with failure and still have fun. Do your best to help him keep his head up and learn the value of commitment. One season of losing is not going to kill your kid. Teaching him the lesson of going back on your word because the situation is difficult is one that could last a lifetime. JMHO...
Well said!!!!! Coming from a dad with a kid playing college baseball -great perspective. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2016 : 07:58:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Baseballrocks123
Team is doing AA tournaments. It's basically the Rec Allstar team from 8u kid pitch. My kid isn't one of the best on the team, they all make errors but we just don't have any pitching. And they get stuck in the field watching the pitcher walk the bases loaded and then throw wild pitches to bring the runs home, and other players just stand there and go into zombie mode then ball finally gets hit and they make an error.
It's just sucking the life out of the whole family.
Thanks for all the feedback.
Welcome to 9u where the entire year has nothing to do with pitching and everything to do with walks. This isn't just your sons team this is VERY common in 9u all around. Please familiarize yourself with the ASMI recommendations for youth pitchers. Then take your kid out to a chain link fence, use plastic straps to attach a hula hoop to the fence at strike zone level, move your kid back the requisite distance and tell him to pitch away.
The positives you are looking for is that he is getting field time, seeing all the things that can go wrong, and learning about the game first hand. At 14u my son seems to magically appear wherever there is an overthrown ball or a wild throw and comes up with the ball. I once asked him how he just popped up in random locations with the ball like that and his response was "I've seen the ball overthrown to that spot for years, I figured someone should be there if it happened again."
My point is, just because the team isn't winning doesn't mean your son isn't learning. |
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HeyBlue
92 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2016 : 09:03:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Baseballrocks123
Kid is 9 and doing travel ball but every game they get destroyed 1-20. Currently they are 0-12. Thinking of taking kid off the team. I don't see any positives to it and they are scheduled to go to mid June.
Thoughts.
Teaching someone to quit is not a good idea. |
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Hurricane
351 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2016 : 14:16:40
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I think the coaches need to work on finding kids that can throw strikes. I say work on him getting better and improving and tell him you guys will find another team next season.
If he is talking about not playing anymore then you have a problem.
Main goal should be him wanting to play next year. Just do your research and find a good fit and include your son in picking the team he wants to play for. Best of luck.
Also:
Why is everyone so against quitting, is quitting not a life lesson? You don't like your job, boss quit find a better fit.
You don't like your boyfriend girl friend dont stick around.
Research shows kids that quit sport young dont quit every job they get when they get older just as kids that are forced to put toys away at a private school can grow up not putting away anything.
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2016 : 14:58:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Hurricane
I think the coaches need to work on finding kids that can throw strikes. I say work on him getting better and improving and tell him you guys will find another team next season.
If he is talking about not playing anymore then you have a problem.
Main goal should be him wanting to play next year. Just do your research and find a good fit and include your son in picking the team he wants to play for. Best of luck.
Also:
Why is everyone so against quitting, is quitting not a life lesson? You don't like your job, boss quit find a better fit.
You don't like your boyfriend girl friend dont stick around.
Research shows kids that quit sport young dont quit every job they get when they get older just as kids that are forced to put toys away at a private school can grow up not putting away anything.
Why am I against quitting...well short version, it's about commitment. You agreed to stay for X months and play with that coach and those kids. If you quit it puts everyone else in a bind. I did my best to teach my son that when you commit you commit, if you aren't sure then don't commit until you are because you are in it for the long haul at that point. The ONLY time I would agree to leave a team is if my son was being damaged mentally or physically.
Your logic of don't like your boss, just quit...um...and who pays your mortgage? And how many times can you quit before you are unemployable?
Don't like your boyfriend/girlfriend don't stick around....again, don't commit until you are sure. Then, if you gave it your best shot or are being emotionally or phsycially damaged then you can leave.
Every parent on this website should be afraid of giving their kid a swelled head. If you have ever heard your son say "I'm too good to play with this team" that is YOUR fault as the parent. We are raising a generation of spoiled brats which is very clear when you see the job hopping and the bed hopping going on in today's world. If you make a commitment, especially if it is ONLY for 4 months, you should stick with it. If YOU didn't like it then do better research next time so you make a better choice. |
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At what point is it OK to pull your kid off team?
