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UPPERDECKER
34 Posts |
 Posted - 04/16/2014 : 09:49:00
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With High School season winding down , did your players playing time meet or exceed expectations?
Did the Head Coach hold up his end of the bargain that he laid out in his pre-season pump-up speech?
Did you find it to be business as usual, a political circus!
With my son's team , for most games ,better players were in the dugout than on the field!
If you experienced any of the scenarios, I would like to hear about them!
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bballguy
224 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 12:53:19
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| My son is having an excellent experience. Coach has run things exactly as described. |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 13:13:21
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The experience this year has been very contrary to years past. Where the coach had always had a strong loyalty to seniors and would keep better and higher performing underclassmen on the bench in favor of struggling or downright bombing seniors, that hasn't been the case this season. He said up front that positions would be up for competition and has held up that philosophy. He has given seniors benefit of the doubt and allowed them to lose their spots, this has, in fact happened. We have three seniors who were under performing and all three had lost their starting spots by mid season. Their replacements are certainly performing better and are now starters. He'll insert them at the right times (in a blow-out, etc.), but they are definitely no longer starting where they once were.
I can honestly say that he's fielding the best talent and lineup on the field. This hasn't been the case in the past. |
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Card6
152 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 13:27:07
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| Politics as usual, administrator kids get their time. But Major players getting most of playing time |
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BREAMKING
323 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 14:26:43
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| I watched jv baseball this year and the program I thought did a pretty good job for JV level baseball. Looking forward to next season. And hopefully the varsity can make a run this season. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 15:29:15
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Playing time has been about what was expected, maybe a little less. The record has been disappointing.
Times have changed in this particular program, so the approach, on a lot of levels, may have to as well.
Zero regrets as his stated goal, since he was 8, was to play for the HS team which he has done. When his career ends at the end of his Senior year he will value his time on the HS team far more than all of his travel teams combined, except maybe for the week at Cooperstown. |
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ECBSWAG
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 15:32:41
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| Well I certainly wish I could say the same thing for my son's high school team. The speech we were given pre-season and the things he has been told during the season have yet come to pass. This has been his first year with high school ball and I must say it has been a very disappointing time for him and very trying time for us as parents. As parents we were really hoping that the circus political comments we have always heard was from a bunch of disgruntled parents but as we have experienced first hand, they were right on the money. I think the worse part is the lengths that some parents will go in order to get their son on the field. Unfortunately for our son, we aren't those kind of parents so he will never see playing time if that is what it takes. We have always taught our kids that regardless of the sport, you pick your spot and earn it because it's not going to be given to you because of who mama and daddy are and what they can bring to the team. The only thing that political coaching teaches a kid is what the real world is like.....it's not what you know, it's who you know. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 15:53:37
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quote:
Originally posted by ECBSWAG
Well I certainly wish I could say the same thing for my son's high school team. The speech we were given pre-season and the things he has been told during the season have yet come to pass. This has been his first year with high school ball and I must say it has been a very disappointing time for him and very trying time for us as parents. As parents we were really hoping that the circus political comments we have always heard was from a bunch of disgruntled parents but as we have experienced first hand, they were right on the money. I think the worse part is the lengths that some parents will go in order to get their son on the field. Unfortunately for our son, we aren't those kind of parents so he will never see playing time if that is what it takes. We have always taught our kids that regardless of the sport, you pick your spot and earn it because it's not going to be given to you because of who mama and daddy are and what they can bring to the team. The only thing that political coaching teaches a kid is what the real world is like.....it's not what you know, it's who you know.
How is the record? I know at our school it seems like the volume of the dissatisfied was louder in years when the team was winning region and advancing in the playoffs, than in years when they didn't. Purely anecdotal and it's only one school, so it may be an aberration.
I can tell you my son would rather be a sub on a 20-4 team than a starter on a 12-12 team. |
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ECBSWAG
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2014 : 16:05:01
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I am not exact on the record, but I do know that we are well below 500. In my opinion, that number could be much higher if some of the better players were on the field and given a chance as they should be. I know my son for one just wants to play baseball and could contribute a lot to the team if given a fair opportunity, as could some of the other boys. But what are you gonna do? Grin, chomp, chew, spit and bare it.
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benchwarmer_2
19 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2014 : 00:12:45
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ECBSWAG Sorry to hear about your "less than promised" HS experience. Seems to be more of a rule than an exception. Curious as to how you handled travel ball this year and what your plans are for this upcoming season. Unfortunately seeing the same thing on the west side of town. Playing time has no rhyme or reason. Can actually say that the player with the lowest average was the one rewarded with the call up to varsity for remainder of the season. For the curious minds... Yes this kid pitches but second string and has one hit all year.
Allstar what about the team that is 12-12 and not 20-4 because the coach plays the team that advances the political agenda and not the score board. Seems to be little incentive for HS coaches to go beyond a 500 record as long as booster/fundraising goals have been met.
Definitely NOT the HS play we've anticipated for all these years. |
Edited by - benchwarmer_2 on 04/17/2014 07:15:06 |
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rippit
667 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2014 : 07:51:53
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Trying to touch on everything mentioned:
Varsity is stacked so no room there as a soph even in a weak region where many sophs could compete due to loyalty to juniors/seniors.
JV seemingly bowing to politics. You look at a couple kids who won't pick up a baseball from now until next January and wonder how in the world they will be able to hit decent pitching as they certainly didn't see any this year.
Have looked at some alternative spring HS teams and find them competitive and most important...FUN.
Have heard several parents of rising juniors say they wouldn't mind their son playing JV as a junior as long as he gets to PLAY and not SIT.
My personal biggest gripe is the kid who can play more than one position getting stuck sharing just one position with another player while the other positions are manned by sub par players and other positions not having to fight for playing time at all. I just don't get that UNLESS it truly has to do with politics/school admin/big booster ball etc. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2014 : 09:32:25
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quote:
Originally posted by rippit
Trying to touch on everything mentioned:
Varsity is stacked so no room there as a soph even in a weak region where many sophs could compete due to loyalty to juniors/seniors.
JV seemingly bowing to politics. You look at a couple kids who won't pick up a baseball from now until next January and wonder how in the world they will be able to hit decent pitching as they certainly didn't see any this year.
Have looked at some alternative spring HS teams and find them competitive and most important...FUN.
Have heard several parents of rising juniors say they wouldn't mind their son playing JV as a junior as long as he gets to PLAY and not SIT.
My personal biggest gripe is the kid who can play more than one position getting stuck sharing just one position with another player while the other positions are manned by sub par players and other positions not having to fight for playing time at all. I just don't get that UNLESS it truly has to do with politics/school admin/big booster ball etc.
After 4 years at a relatively politics-free program I realize that there is no such thing as 100% politics-free. Definitely see some favorites-playing.
A lot depends on expectations. If my son wanted to play college ball, I almost surely would have investigated some of the alternative options besides the HS team just so he could get more games and playing time in and keep pitching. I have said before, all he wanted to do is play for the HS team. He's done that and now he is ready to graduate and get on with it. So he accepts what it is at his HS. Earlier in his career, say from 12-15 YO, he wouldn't have bought in.
A couple of underclassmen see a bottleneck at their positions. Would not surprise me at all to see them somewhere else next year. |
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DecaturDad
619 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2014 : 10:16:09
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My son has had a great first year of high school ball. As long as one understands that high school does not replace travel for those who want to continue on, I think he had a great season. He got a lot of playing time and a lot of experience just practices with the older kids. he also received lots of great advice about the recruiting process from some of the seniors. I think the coach played the best players for the situation all season. For example, some times if we played a weaker team, we sat some starters and gave others a chance. As a parent, I did not see any "political" influence effecting playing time. Sure there were parents complaining in the stands. But we could not have asked for a better freshman season. I will thank you coaching staff at the end of the season and truly mean it.
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2014 : 11:01:26
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quote:
Originally posted by DecaturDad
As a parent, I did not see any "political" influence effecting playing time. Sure there were parents complaining in the stands.
Hate to say it, but these are the people who will be complaining that there is politics going on. DecaturDad, you did not see politics going on, but I guarantee these other people did. Politics is an easy way for parents to put the responsibility on something other than the player's performance.
I'm sure this comment is going to ruffle some feathers and I'm not pointing out anyone in particular. Everyone needs to take the attitude that if a player is not getting the play time they think they should, encourage your player to get better. Make it to where the coach can't help but to put your player in. Sometimes that's not easy when you are playing on a stacked team. But that is the only way to get on the field. As long as "politics" are blamed, you cannot take full responsibility and make the changes necessary to play ball.
We've been through 4 years of pre-HS travel ball, 4 years of HS, 4 years of HS aged travel ball, 2 years of college ball and one year of a summer collegiate league. If you blame something other than your own performance, you will not get on the field. I've seen it happen too many times to believe otherwise. |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2014 : 14:58:15
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quote:
Originally posted by bballman
quote:
Originally posted by DecaturDad
As a parent, I did not see any "political" influence effecting playing time. Sure there were parents complaining in the stands.
Hate to say it, but these are the people who will be complaining that there is politics going on. DecaturDad, you did not see politics going on, but I guarantee these other people did. Politics is an easy way for parents to put the responsibility on something other than the player's performance.
I'm sure this comment is going to ruffle some feathers and I'm not pointing out anyone in particular. Everyone needs to take the attitude that if a player is not getting the play time they think they should, encourage your player to get better. Make it to where the coach can't help but to put your player in. Sometimes that's not easy when you are playing on a stacked team. But that is the only way to get on the field. As long as "politics" are blamed, you cannot take full responsibility and make the changes necessary to play ball.
We've been through 4 years of pre-HS travel ball, 4 years of HS, 4 years of HS aged travel ball, 2 years of college ball and one year of a summer collegiate league. If you blame something other than your own performance, you will not get on the field. I've seen it happen too many times to believe otherwise.
RIGHT ON!!!
I've witnessed this through the years myself. If the kid isn't playing, few will ever admit that there isn't some reason OTHER than performance dictating it.
Also, don't forget that parents see about 10% of what high school coaches see. A couple of years ago, our HS team couldn't field a ball up the middle infield. Seemed like there was a million dollar bonus to the kid who could finish with the most errors (it was that bad). There was an underclassman that looked much better defensively than the uppers who were splitting time. I asked my son (an outfielder), why player X wasn't playing when he appeared to be such a better option than the others. My son advised me that at practice, he was just as bad as the others and that he wasn't the answer.
Great insight from someone who knew to someone who thought he knew.
I'll bet that many of the parents blaming others only see the good plays and find every excuse under the sun to ignore or explain away the poor ones. |
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hshuler
1074 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2014 : 16:15:56
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| I am sure that it varies from program to program but I heard a AAAAAA in GA explain it this way. He said "I am coaching at the highest level in GA and if I don't win, I will get fired. If I get fired, I will probably have to move my family. I like this community and don't want to move my family. So, I am not interested in how many years of travel ball Lil Johnny played. If he can help us win, he will play now. If not, he will play when he can help us." |
Edited by - hshuler on 04/21/2014 17:17:12 |
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DecaturDad
619 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2014 : 20:45:19
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quote:
Originally posted by hshuler
I am sure that it varies from program to program but I heard a AAAAAA in GA explain it this way. He said "I am coaching at the highest level in GA and if I don't win, I will get fired. If I get fired, I will probably have to move my family. I like this community and don't want to move my family. So, I am not interested in how many years of travel ball Lil Johnny played. If he can help us win, he will play now. If not, he will play when he can help us."
I basicly told my son the same thing when he tried out. If the coach thinks you can help him win, you play. If not, you sit. So far, he has been playing.
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LvilleYankees
132 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2014 : 09:27:46
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| My son is a freshman and has loved every moment of it. There is no politics at the school he goes to. The coaching these kids get is top notch and wether they start or sit they get better. If your good and do what the coaches ask of you on and off the field you will play. I'm looking forward to the next 6 years as both of my boys will go through this program. |
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Buckner
44 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2014 : 12:34:12
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| Way less politics than everyone warned about. The best kids played. More expensive than I planned on. |
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Strategizer
86 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2014 : 14:57:27
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| I do believe politics exists in some form or fashion at the High School level. To what extent? That's debatable. With that being said, I also believe coaches try to field the best players. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2014 : 17:09:51
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To be honest with you, it doesn't matter if politics exist or not. If you use it as an excuse for lack of play time, you will never get the play time. I think if it exists, it will only come down to making a decision between two players of equal talent. Player A brings X value to the team and Player B brings the same value. Player A is more likable to the coach and his dad is the booster club president, so Player A plays. If you are Player B, do what you have to do to make sure that you bring more value to the team than Player A and then you will play. A coach cannot afford to have the better player sitting on the bench. If you are that much better than Player A, the coach will play you.
And In The Know is right. There is more that goes on behind the scenes than meets the eye. Bottom line, if you use an external source as an excuse, you will never get better. If you don't get better you won't play. Don't use someone else as an excuse and don't let your player use someone else as an excuse. Take a good hard look in the mirror and see what you can do to get better. I don't care how good you are, you can always get better. That should be every players goal.
My son pitches for a top 10 in the country Division 2 school. He has the most relief innings on the team. Has pitched 30 innings against some of the best Division 2 competition in the country and has a 2.10 ERA for the year so far (knock on wood) and all he can talk about is what he needs to improve on with his mechanics to be better. He is not satisfied. In my opinion, every player should have that attitude. Don't blame someone else, look at what you can do to be better.
Sorry for the ramble. |
Edited by - bballman on 04/22/2014 17:24:08 |
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ATLDodgers
21 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2014 : 01:26:09
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Thats one of the best posts on here, period. If every player focused on getting better vs on how to get more playing time there would be a lot better teams and players out there, and the playing time would come.
Our High School experience has gone well, mine is in tenth grade and has played(last year) and started(this year) on varsity. He can play and the team has a need for him.
It seems like there are a lot of people out there who think "the man" is trying to hold them down... Get a trainer and get to work. |
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Critical Mass
277 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2014 : 07:59:47
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bballman:i love to hear real stories like yours and wish your son the absolute best.
My kid only pitched a few games last year as a soph. We had a few Sr pitchers that threw 88-90 and innings went to them. We had a marginal season and couldn't hit our way out of a paper bag. This year, my son is on the verge of leading Cobb county in K's,leads the team in innings of work, and is undefeated with the 2nd best record for a pitcher in the county. We are a team full of Jrs with a few Sr players,the chemistry is awesome and we are headed to the state playoffs. Any time i hear excuses, i respond with "Keep Grindin", until you have no areas to improve you dont have the luxury to blame anyone else. Coaches aren't perfect and even if they played all of the best players, there would be parents B*%&$#(@ about playing time. We all love our kids, some just choose to parent in different ways. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2014 : 08:11:14
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quote:
Originally posted by bballman
To be honest with you, it doesn't matter if politics exist or not. If you use it as an excuse for lack of play time, you will never get the play time. I think if it exists, it will only come down to making a decision between two players of equal talent. Player A brings X value to the team and Player B brings the same value. Player A is more likable to the coach and his dad is the booster club president, so Player A plays. If you are Player B, do what you have to do to make sure that you bring more value to the team than Player A and then you will play. A coach cannot afford to have the better player sitting on the bench. If you are that much better than Player A, the coach will play you.
And In The Know is right. There is more that goes on behind the scenes than meets the eye. Bottom line, if you use an external source as an excuse, you will never get better. If you don't get better you won't play. Don't use someone else as an excuse and don't let your player use someone else as an excuse. Take a good hard look in the mirror and see what you can do to get better. I don't care how good you are, you can always get better. That should be every players goal.
My son pitches for a top 10 in the country Division 2 school. He has the most relief innings on the team. Has pitched 30 innings against some of the best Division 2 competition in the country and has a 2.10 ERA for the year so far (knock on wood) and all he can talk about is what he needs to improve on with his mechanics to be better. He is not satisfied. In my opinion, every player should have that attitude. Don't blame someone else, look at what you can do to be better.
Sorry for the ramble.
The other thing that I would add is that the coaches see them every day in practice, dads and moms don't. At least I don't. Since the practice time outweighs the game time by 10 to 1 I have to assume they are seeing something that drives their in-game decision-making.
I hope what I said about favoritism didn't get misconstrued. The favoritism that I think could be perceived on our team doesn't have anything to do with my son's position or playing time. He is more in a situation where the players are pretty even, so I assume what happens in practice is driving playing time. I wish for his sake that he was getting a little more, but assume that the coach is just doing what he thinks will put us in a position to win.
If that's NOT the case, it's not the end of the world. He's got a lot bigger fish to fry than baseball starting as soon as the season ends. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2014 : 09:18:42
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quote:
Originally posted by ATLDodgers
It seems like there are a lot of people out there who think "the man" is trying to hold them down... Get a trainer and get to work.
Bingo! |
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ECBSWAG
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2014 : 16:59:11
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| I can honestly say that my son does not fall in the category of not being a good player. A lot of people that see him play knows him and remembers him from one field to another, but I am also speaking of this being in the travel ball world. Is he the perfect makes no mistakes at all ballplayer, no. But he is much better than some of the ones that are being played non stop on the high school team. We also live in a small town, so yes, politics is a very big component at the high school baseball level. We sit back, watch, listen and put the pieces together. All I can say is that I am so glad that this is the last week of high school baseball and we can gear up for travel ball where I know he will get to play. Hope the weather stays good this weekend for all of us baseball families!!! |
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High School Season Experiences
