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BBall123
395 Posts |
 Posted - 07/19/2013 : 09:18:03
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What is it with all these exorbitant baseball fee's?
Am I the only one who thinks $3800 is an awful lot of money to pay for spring baseball? Plus the $800 to $2000 for high school ball?
One "organization" is charging $3600 for some "ex" pro to hit your kid ground balls for a few months, Then another "organization" across town is charging $3800. What's next, $4200? $4600? How about $5000?
These "organizations" are popping up all over town and as they do, the fee's are going higher and higher. Of course, as some of these "organizations" like to present it, " it's all for the kids "
Is baseball becoming a sport for only the kids from well off family's?
Are the less fortunate kids being left out?
Say what you want to about East Cobb, but they have been consistent in their fee's for years. We all used to complain about their $1600 fee and that was 7 years ago. I have talked with several ECB coaches and they are all still in the $1600 to $2200 range.
Do you really believe you get $2000 worth more bang for your money paying these high fee's than you do at these other (just as competitive) team? I'm sorry to say I have been there and the fact of the matter is YOU DONT !
How can we control these sky rocketing cost's? Don't pay them.
This is just my opinion but in my experience its smarter to put your kid on a team that fits and does not break the bank, with a coach who cares. And then get some private instruction here and there as needed.
Do a set of $700 uniforms make your kid a better ball player? no (but it makes the "organization" look more attractive). Do paying these fee's and playing for these "organizations" make your kid a better ball player? Maybe
We have played these teams with less expensive uni's and much cheaper fee's and they played just as well or better than we did. So I guess you will have to make that call.
Your thoughts?
And FYI, in my opinion at 15U when the season is shortened to 2 months due to school ball, THE FEE SHOULD GO DOWN NOT UP.
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Edited by - BBall123 on 07/19/2013 10:11:19 |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2013 : 11:41:44
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My son's 17U team was $1,200 for returning players and we didn't get new uniforms. It was a couple hundred more for new players so they could get unis.
The 16U team was $2,000 because everyone got unis.
Both teams played about 40 games. |
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bigmcbb
46 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2013 : 12:42:28
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| Somebody has to pay for the "scholarship" players. |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2013 : 13:21:11
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Great post, and like everything in a free market economy, you can choose to pay it or not. To be quite honest, there's MUCH more to it than just level of baseball and instruction. It will sound quite elitist, but there is a level of class discrimination that results from the more expensive options. This tends to lead to a different class of player, parent and behavior of both. Of course there are exceptions, but by and large, the more expensive the team, the more this holds true.
So, for that group that can and chooses to afford the more expensive options, they are socializing with others that tend to share their class and social status. There is value in this. Frankly, we've all seen what we would consider the "redneck" teams, etc, that display a behavior at the player and parent level that we'd prefer not to be around or expose our children to. So, for that there is a cost.
I'm not saying that an inexpensive team won't have great discipline, instruction and behavior from player, coach to parent, but I have recognized that the density of this tends to follow suit with the cost to play.
Much like Six Flags and Disney. One is much less expensive to visit. The overall experience between the two is also significantly different. I haven't been to Six Flags in at least 5-6 years. I have no interest in seeing a guy 60 lbs overweight with his shirt off in the log plume ride. You're not going to see that at Disney. IMHO, well worth the increased cost.
As I started my reply, it's a free market, and if you are getting the same instruction, field access and growth for your player at a substantially lower cost than the higher priced options, and none of the other points I've raised factor in, then go for it. I'm not happy with the rising cost myself, but I'm willing to make certain sacrifices, not necessarily to ensure my kid is AT a certain place, but more so to ensure he ISN'T at some places. |
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BBall123
395 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2013 : 14:40:28
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Hmm. Interesting points In the know . Just raise the prices to freeze the commoner or (redneck) out of baseball? Got it.
Can't be fraternizing with the common folk. I like it. LOL
Of course then skill set won't matter just " can you pay"
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Edited by - BBall123 on 07/19/2013 15:25:35 |
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nwgadad
137 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2013 : 16:07:55
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| I don't like the rising gas prices, cost of living keeps going up too, yet my paycheck does not rise at the same rate. While sad that prices are going up, make sure the team shows you a budget. You also have to see what agew group. As they get older tehy may have paid instruction too where younger groups typically use dads. Also, you may want to look at cost vs benefit. Is it worth it? |
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DSBDG
196 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2013 : 16:12:48
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| Ask to see a budget. If the greater expense is for indoor training space, weight or strength training, or other hard costs, it may be worth it. If you're paying a big fee to a "parent" program, that may or may not benefit you. Items for a budget should include --- uniforms, field space, coaching fees, tournament fees, gate fees, equipment (baseballs), indoor space, etc. If you know the different line items for each team, you can compare them. |
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Kmk72
112 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2013 : 11:00:50
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why any organization would charge a fee to tryout is ridiculous...
Some of these team do charge 2700 or so but there is very little fund raising. A lot of folks dont like to do it....
That 2700 can come doen quickly with a few fun fundraisers... |
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GeorgiaPeach
26 Posts |
Posted - 07/21/2013 : 16:44:02
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| As one of those who has played in the "high dollar" programs, I can assure you that the detailed financials of the team are not available for parental inspection. They must be accepted as is. How much goes to coaches salary, tournament expenses, etc. are pure guesswork and I assume this is how that it will always be. For me, I will not pay these exorbitant fees for two months of baseball anymore. |
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larryjr
46 Posts |
Posted - 07/22/2013 : 10:41:32
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| At the end of the day, the rising fees are about supply and demand. The top organizations have "pros" who are non-dad coaches that also have a network of connections in the college ranks. You can do the math easily to unbundle their program costs if you would like to know what each pro makes for income. They are not getting rich but if the demand is present, then they fill the void and earn a living...the American dream of doing what you love and paying your bills. Any program that keeps their costs down, probably has a ton of POs and overall large roster. It takes a fixed amount of money to pay for the unis, field access, tournament entry fees and leftovers go to the coaches. We all have to make the choice for our son and family so choose wisely! |
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RACGOFAR
208 Posts |
Posted - 07/23/2013 : 08:54:15
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| For 12u and under, you should find a team that provides development, competition, and elevates your player to the next level. For 13u and up, it's development,competition and exposure. Prices vary, just like talent and ability vary. Fund a team at your son's talent level that fits your budget and provides the best combination and balance of these three things. I believe the first two are most important. If you son is not going to play much, it's hard to get better, and you should drop down a class or find another team in his class with kids closer to his ability where he can better compete for playing time. |
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TheNatural
37 Posts |
Posted - 07/23/2013 : 13:14:45
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quote:
Originally posted by larryjr
At the end of the day, the rising fees are about supply and demand. The top organizations have "pros" who are non-dad coaches that also have a network of connections in the college ranks.
ECB is a top organization does it have pros? 2 teams maybe the rest are dads coaching even as high as 14 and 15. |
Edited by - TheNatural on 07/23/2013 18:15:49 |
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SpeedKills
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/23/2013 : 17:09:53
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| It is what it is. I was going to take my son tootryout for a ECB team, not the main one just one where it was one team looking at him. He stii has to register even thou he may not make a team. Has to pay the tryout fee also. |
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SpeedKills
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/23/2013 : 21:17:19
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quote:
Originally posted by TheNatural
quote:
Originally posted by larryjr
At the end of the day, the rising fees are about supply and demand. The top organizations have "pros" who are non-dad coaches that also have a network of connections in the college ranks.
ECB is a top organization does it have pros? 2 teams maybe the rest are dads coaching even as high as 14 and 15.
I don't have a problem with dads coaching if they have played past high school. |
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db1966
28 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 07:38:12
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Our 16u "redneck" team a few years ago won all 6 tournaments we went to then took 2nd in the world series. Beat alot of high dollar teams along the way! There was no poor behavior displayed by our kids (wasnt tolerated) but we did witness some bad behavior from the elitist kids when they were beaten by a t-shirt wearing team!
The worse thing that has happened to baseball is daddy-ball. From the dads that practice it to the constant complaints about it. Baseball should be a father-son sport and I know alot of dad's that are way better coaches than some of the paid coaches we have seen or played under. Just because you could play past high school doesn't mean you can coach! |
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baseballatitsfinest
47 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 09:17:30
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| speedkills, What does playing past high school have to do with ANYTHING! Too often you see someone posting their credentials... I played here and here and this many years in the majors. That is great but it DOES NOT mean they can TEACH the game.JMO |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 11:06:05
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quote:
Originally posted by db1966
Our 16u "redneck" team a few years ago won all 6 tournaments we went to then took 2nd in the world series. Beat alot of high dollar teams along the way! There was no poor behavior displayed by our kids (wasnt tolerated) but we did witness some bad behavior from the elitist kids when they were beaten by a t-shirt wearing team!
Then it wasn't a "redneck" team. It's not a geography thing, it's a behavior thing. I stated there is poor behavior from expensive and inexpensive teams. There are teams I would deem "redneck" playing out of the likes of ECB and other expensive options. I've even had my own "redneck" moments over the years, but I've learned from each and don't repeat them. All I was stating was that the concentration of good and poor behavior TENDS to follow the money. Don't imply that because you charge half the fees of another team and you may play from a small, rural part of the country that "redneck" applies. Perhaps I should have used the term "dipstick" instead.
I also don't believe it was implied that poor behavior on the part of a team was a reflection of their talent. On the contrary. My son's teams have had their tails handed to them by some VERY talented teams whose parent's I wouldn't want to have anything to do with. They may kick our butts wearing airbrushed muscle shirts every time we play them, won't change my opinion of whom I'd prefer to spend a season with. |
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M. Bare
26 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 13:07:00
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quote:
Originally posted by TheNatural
quote:
Originally posted by larryjr
At the end of the day, the rising fees are about supply and demand. The top organizations have "pros" who are non-dad coaches that also have a network of connections in the college ranks.
ECB is a top organization does it have pros? 2 teams maybe the rest are dads coaching even as high as 14 and 15.
Seriously, you're claiming that out of the 80+ teams at ECB only 2 have coaches who have played pro ball? Most teams at ECB have at least one or more coaches who have played college ball and quite a lot have coaches who played pro ball at some level. I get that playing at a high level doesn't equate to being a good coach but most are and they know the game better than anyone and Larry Jr. is right on about their network of connections in college and pro ranks. Playing any sport at such a high level is very, very rare and everyone knows everyone. |
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tommynole99
48 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 16:29:32
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Ok I get it that teams were getting tired of players showing up for a good workout with little intention of ever playing for said team, but these tryout fees are getting out of hand. I am ok with $25 even $45 if at the end of the day the player at least got a good workout, but to attend a tryout with 60 plus players is ridiculious. How can a coaching staff evalute that many players in two hours.
As for travel baseball cost much over 2K seems silly to me since I paid nearly 3K last year at a so called Academy which was disastrous! |
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4bagger
131 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 17:44:23
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My kid went to the cattle call at ECB Monday night with all those kids and we knew the teams were, for the most part, already decided. We expected nothing to come of it but a few swings of the bat and a handful of pitches thrown and he would go home and forget about it.
We've received two calls already from 2 of the new teams who want to see him at a private workout before this weekends cluster****.
The purpose of the cattle call was for the coaches to see if there were any "diamonds in the rough" worth focusing on this weekend. They accomplished their goal. Neither Monday nor the privates cost anything, only this upcoming weekend. So for the ones with a shot at an opening they got Monday, one or two privates and the weekend tryout for $135, or about $11 - $16 an hour depending on how long this weekend takes.
This weekend at ECB they won't focus on the 300 kids trying out. They will ignore the ones already on teams and the ones they saw Monday night who will obviously be passed over and focus on the ones they identified Monday night as worth another look at a private. That takes an unmanageable 300 kids down to a dozen or so to fill the spots they have left. Smart, if you ask me. |
Edited by - 4bagger on 07/24/2013 20:23:42 |
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coach0512
123 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 17:59:47
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Wouldn't it be nirvana for baseball organizations to step forward with honesty and say "here is the returning roster for XYZ team. We are adding 3 players to this roster. If you want to try and make the team we are having tryouts on X date at X time".
Quite lying and saying "all slots are open" or "the teams not picked yet" or "everyone needs to re-earn their spot", we are not stupid out here!
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BBall123
395 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2013 : 18:07:48
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Do you really think that money dictates class, character or behavior? You may want to re think that one chief.
Anyway,,
Just because you were a pro does not automatically mean you can coach, manage a team and the family's. Or teach the game, or relate to the kids. There are a LOT of great dad coaches out there and a LOT of great coaches who are neither dad's or ex pros.
There are those ex pro's etc. out there that are involved in youth baseball simply for their love of the game and a desire and willingness to help the kids.
Then their are those that are trying to build a business and every decision they make is centered around building that business and NOT what's best for your kid.
THIS, is the distinction we as parents have to make, its easy to say this and that when you are promoting your business, but actions speak louder than words. Before you go out and spend $3600 or $3800 dollars to get your kid on a team just because they have some ex pro's on staff. Look at how many stay next year, talk to people who were or have been in the program see what they have to say about it.
You might find that you will have as much fun and learn just as much on an $1800 or $2000 dollar team with good coaches. AND be $1800 dollars richer in the process.
IMHO |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2013 : 08:10:35
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quote:
Originally posted by coach0512
Wouldn't it be nirvana for baseball organizations to step forward with honesty and say "here is the returning roster for XYZ team. We are adding 3 players to this roster. If you want to try and make the team we are having tryouts on X date at X time".
Quite lying and saying "all slots are open" or "the teams not picked yet" or "everyone needs to re-earn their spot", we are not stupid out here!
Good point and that brings up another question;
Do you think an organization is going to cut sub par players, whos parents pay big bucks for private instruction, pay all their fees and team dues up front, for more athletic and better baseball players?
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Newbie BB Mom
141 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2013 : 08:43:42
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quote:
Originally posted by 743
quote:
Originally posted by coach0512
Wouldn't it be nirvana for baseball organizations to step forward with honesty and say "here is the returning roster for XYZ team. We are adding 3 players to this roster. If you want to try and make the team we are having tryouts on X date at X time".
Quite lying and saying "all slots are open" or "the teams not picked yet" or "everyone needs to re-earn their spot", we are not stupid out here!
Good point and that brings up another question;
Do you think an organization is going to cut sub par players, whos parents pay big bucks for private instruction, pay all their fees and team dues up front, for more athletic and better baseball players?
Any good business will make sure they both keep their customers happy and produce a good product. In the baseball industrial complex that means making sure that (1) you can improve the baseball players you pick and (2) your teams remain competitive. Otherwise, people won't keep buying what your selling. So, the answer is no, if they have any business sense, they're not going to keep "sub par" players on their teams because their parents are big spenders. |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2013 : 12:13:54
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| So a good business would not make sure they keep the customers that spend the most money? That doesn't make sense to me. Add a couple of spots on every roster and it doesn't hurt your wins and loses but insures you keep getting paid. |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2013 : 12:17:42
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| Come to think if it, if this wasn't true then East Cobb Baseball would only have about 3 major teams per age group instead of a bunch of teams that are AAA. |
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Fee's for travel ball going higher and higher ?
