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CenterField
138 Posts |
 Posted - 06/24/2013 : 14:50:46
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| Lets say you have a runner on 2nd with no outs and you call on your hitter to bunt the runner over to 3rd base. Lets assume that its a pretty obvious sacrifice situation. However, the hitter lays down a great bunt, advances the runner, and beats the throw to 1st base from either the 3B or P. Do you score that as a Sacrifice or Infield Single?? |
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wright_43
13 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 14:58:24
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Infield single. Sacrifice requires the batter to be out.
Edited with rule from MLB rule book.
10.08 Sacrifices
The official scorer shall:
(a) Score a sacrifice bunt when, before two are out, the batter advances one or more runners with a bunt and is put out at first base, or would have been put out except for a fielding error, unless, in the judgment of the official scorer, the batter was bunting exclusively for a base hit and not sacrificing his own chance of reaching first base for the purpose of advancing a runner or runners, in which case the official scorer shall charge the batter with a time at bat;
Rule 10.08(a) Comment: In determining whether the batter had been sacrificing his own chance of reaching first base for the purpose of advancing a runner, the official scorer shall give the batter the benefit of the doubt. The official scorer shall consider the totality of the circumstances of the at-bat, including the inning, the number of outs and the score.
(b) Score a sacrifice bunt when, before two are out, the fielders handle a bunted ball without error in an unsuccessful attempt to put out a preceding runner advancing one base, unless, an attempt to turn a bunt into a putout of a preceding runner fails, and in the judgment of the official scorer ordinary effort would not have put out the batter at first base, in which case the batter shall be credited with a one-base hit and not a sacrifice;
(c) Not score a sacrifice bunt when any runner is put out attempting to advance one base on a bunt, in which case the official scorer shall charge the batter with a time at bat; and
(d) Score a sacrifice fly when, before two are out, the batter hits a ball in flight handled by an outfielder or an infielder running in the outfield in fair or foul territory that
(1) is caught, and a runner scores after the catch, or
(2) is dropped, and a runner scores, if in the scorer's judgment the runner could have scored after the catch had the fly been caught.
Rule 10.08(d) Comment: The official scorer shall score a sacrifice fly in accordance with Rule 10.08(d)(2) even though another runner is forced out by reason of the batter becoming a runner. |
Edited by - wright_43 on 06/24/2013 16:14:01 |
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prestont
197 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 15:03:33
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I guess my question is..... Why would it not be scored a hit?
Your hitter executed better than the other team, and shouldn't be penalized by it. |
Edited by - prestont on 06/24/2013 16:14:01 |
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christheump
351 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 15:28:25
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| I believe it would be a scored a single unless there was an error on the play. |
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Canton Chargers
885 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 15:30:18
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| Single, if there was no error on the play. It's opionated by the scorekeeper, but if he lays down a great bunt and gets on base without a fielding bobble or bad throw/ missed catch at first, it's a single all day long... |
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nwgadad
137 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 15:44:59
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| Infield single. |
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TOPDOG
92 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 15:58:44
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singlequote:
Originally posted by CenterField
Lets say you have a runner on 2nd with no outs and you call on your hitter to bunt the runner over to 3rd base. Lets assume that its a pretty obvious sacrifice situation. However, the hitter lays down a great bunt, advances the runner, and beats the throw to 1st base from either the 3B or P. Do you score that as a Sacrifice or Infield Single??
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 16:54:04
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It's sort of a funny question. You're trying to factor the intent of the batter into how it should be scored.
Using that logic, because the batter wanted to sacrifice, a hit should not be ruled a hit. With that same logic, every time a batter comes to the plate, they should be given a hit because that's their intent, regardless of the outcome.
In your example, through his attempt to sacrifice the runner, he got a hit. It's scored a single. |
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CenterField
138 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 17:17:31
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| Thanks for the reference @wright_43. So it seems that Section 10.08b addresses this situation in my example. It seems to direct the scorekeeper to score Sacrifice or Hit based on the infielders attempt to put out the runner or batter. I would imagine that if the infielders make no attempt either way (watching ball in hopes of rolling foul) then its scorekeeper discretion. |
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rippit
667 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 18:30:41
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| Let me go ask game changer. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 19:18:00
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quote:
Originally posted by CenterField
Thanks for the reference @wright_43. So it seems that Section 10.08b addresses this situation in my example. It seems to direct the scorekeeper to score Sacrifice or Hit based on the infielders attempt to put out the runner or batter. I would imagine that if the infielders make no attempt either way (watching ball in hopes of rolling foul) then its scorekeeper discretion.
If the runner is safe and the batter is safe, regardless of intent and with the absence of an error, it is a hit. Score keepers judgement has nothing to do with it. In the example you just gave, this is clearly a hit, there is no judgement involved.
The only judgement involved in a bunt with runner on is if an out is made - or if there is a question about whether an error is made. If the batter is thrown out, a SK can make a judgement about whether he was bunting for a hit or for a sac. Benefit of the doubt goes to sac, but if the batter lays down a perfect bunt and is safe and the base runner is safe, it's just a hit.
Did something specific happen to make you question this? Sounds like you are pushing for a sacrifice instead of a hit. If I'm a batter, I'll take a hit over a sac any day!! |
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lives4bb
55 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2013 : 19:37:22
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| If there was an error on the play it should be scored an error and a sacrifice therefore no at bat. |
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HITANDRUN
436 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2013 : 07:57:21
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I actually think that technically if it was a sac bunt the play should be scored a sac. I have played with 2 teams where a dad coach would bunt their kid every time there was a runner on 1st base or 2nd so they could pad their kids average
by scoring a base hit if everyone was safe and score it a sac if the bunter was put out at first. So I think as long as the kid bunting is not your son or the coaches son or it is not a play that always happens then score it a hit. |
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CenterField
138 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2013 : 09:03:30
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quote:
Originally posted by bballman
Did something specific happen to make you question this? Sounds like you are pushing for a sacrifice instead of a hit. If I'm a batter, I'll take a hit over a sac any day!!
Yes, same scenario happened twice in a recent tournament. In one case it was scored SAC and the other a Hit. In both cases everyone was safe, but I cant remember exactly what the fielders did.
Thanks to community for the feedback! |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2013 : 13:34:23
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quote:
Originally posted by HITANDRUN
I actually think that technically if it was a sac bunt the play should be scored a sac. I have played with 2 teams where a dad coach would bunt their kid every time there was a runner on 1st base or 2nd so they could pad their kids average
by scoring a base hit if everyone was safe and score it a sac if the bunter was put out at first. So I think as long as the kid bunting is not your son or the coaches son or it is not a play that always happens then score it a hit.
Doesn't matter who the kid is. If everyone is safe and there is no error, it goes as a hit. A sacrifice bunt means that a batter sacrificed himself in order to move a runner over a base. If the batter is safe, he didn't sacrifice himself. He got a hit. Simple as that.
quote:
Originally posted by CenterField
Yes, same scenario happened twice in a recent tournament. In one case it was scored SAC and the other a Hit. In both cases everyone was safe, but I cant remember exactly what the fielders did.
Thanks to community for the feedback!
Sounds like ignorant score keepers to me. I think everyone here is agreeing on what it should be scored. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2013 : 13:39:13
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There are ignorant scorekeepers at every level. I had a situation recently in my son's collegiate summer league. 9 inning game. Starter went the 1st four innings and came out in the 5th. Gave up one hit, then a wild pitch and my son relieved him. He went the final 5 innings. Plus score was tied 1-1 when starter came out. We went up for good in the 6th inning. Score keeper for that game gave the starter the win and my son a save. Certainly not right. I emailed the league and just asked how could the starter get a win only pitching 4 innings and leaving when the game was tied? Next time I looked at the box score and stats, my son was credited with the win. Kind of important because college coaches are probably looking at the stats for the players and possibly some pro scouts. It should be right.
Point is, many people don't know the rules and it will likely be an issue no matter what level you son plays to. |
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Official Scoring Question
