| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
WestCoastGuru
148 Posts |
 Posted - 03/17/2013 : 11:39:37
|
As we all know, this is probably the most subjective and criticized aspect of this great game. While I think that most umpires are going to have varying degrees of what they determine to be a strike zone, coaches and fans in one dugout or the other are not going to be happy with some borderline calls.
My question or asking for opinions from parents and coaches alike....would you rather have a tight or wider strike zone? and if wider, would you rather a strike zone be a little on the high and low side or a little wide off of the plate?
|
|
|
Dplay
13 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2013 : 15:29:40
|
| I would prefer the zone be what is defined by the rules. That being said when an Ump establishes a zone that he stays there and it doesn't float. Players have to learn what to look for and adjust if he keeps a consistant zone. To me that is the most important thing in subjectivity. |
 |
|
|
christheump
351 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2013 : 08:17:24
|
quote:
Originally posted by WestCoastGuru
As we all know, this is probably the most subjective and criticized aspect of this great game. While I think that most umpires are going to have varying degrees of what they determine to be a strike zone, coaches and fans in one dugout or the other are not going to be happy with some borderline calls.
My question or asking for opinions from parents and coaches alike....would you rather have a tight or wider strike zone? and if wider, would you rather a strike zone be a little on the high and low side or a little wide off of the plate?
You cant have it both ways. You better keep it either in and out or up and down, but never in, out, up, and down. My preference is in and out, as most parents and coaches can tell if it is high or low, but in and out becomes more difficult for them. |
|
|
|
bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2013 : 10:30:26
|
| Agree with what has been said here in that I would rather just see it consistent. Without consistency, no one, batters or hitters know what to expect. As a pitcher's dad, I would prefer to see the low pitches called. |
|
|
|
WestCoastGuru
148 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2013 : 10:35:13
|
quote:
Originally posted by christheump
quote:
Originally posted by WestCoastGuru
As we all know, this is probably the most subjective and criticized aspect of this great game. While I think that most umpires are going to have varying degrees of what they determine to be a strike zone, coaches and fans in one dugout or the other are not going to be happy with some borderline calls.
My question or asking for opinions from parents and coaches alike....would you rather have a tight or wider strike zone? and if wider, would you rather a strike zone be a little on the high and low side or a little wide off of the plate?
You cant have it both ways. You better keep it either in and out or up and down, but never in, out, up, and down. My preference is in and out, as most parents and coaches can tell if it is high or low, but in and out becomes more difficult for them.
Guess my concern as a coach, is teaching discipline of the strike zone and having to adjust to an umpire's strike zone accordingly. Consistency goes along way with me late in the game, but when I see catchers reaching over to the opposite batters box and seeing kids getting rung up, becomes very difficult to take in stride. Under the age of 13, I feel the strike zone should be more of a verticle liberty than a horizontal liberty....can't expect a kid that 4'8" and a 29" bat, reach a pitch 10 inches off the plate. |
Edited by - WestCoastGuru on 03/18/2013 10:37:44 |
|
|
|
christheump
351 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2013 : 11:27:25
|
quote:
Originally posted by WestCoastGuru
quote:
Originally posted by christheump
quote:
Originally posted by WestCoastGuru
As we all know, this is probably the most subjective and criticized aspect of this great game. While I think that most umpires are going to have varying degrees of what they determine to be a strike zone, coaches and fans in one dugout or the other are not going to be happy with some borderline calls.
My question or asking for opinions from parents and coaches alike....would you rather have a tight or wider strike zone? and if wider, would you rather a strike zone be a little on the high and low side or a little wide off of the plate?
You cant have it both ways. You better keep it either in and out or up and down, but never in, out, up, and down. My preference is in and out, as most parents and coaches can tell if it is high or low, but in and out becomes more difficult for them.
Guess my concern as a coach, is teaching discipline of the strike zone and having to adjust to an umpire's strike zone accordingly. Consistency goes along way with me late in the game, but when I see catchers reaching over to the opposite batters box and seeing kids getting rung up, becomes very difficult to take in stride. Under the age of 13, I feel the strike zone should be more of a verticle liberty than a horizontal liberty....can't expect a kid that 4'8" and a 29" bat, reach a pitch 10 inches off the plate.
I was just giving you an umpires perspective...its easier to get away with an in/out off the plate than up/down strike. But a ball in the other batters box is a stretch...I gave the pitchers a lil in and out and knees but not the high strike... |
|
|
|
zwndad
170 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2013 : 14:19:51
|
| Consistency is key, but I told my kids to stop worrying about what the umpire is calling a strike. Know what you can hit (ball or strike), and go hit it when you see it. With that said, I agree with Chris. Up above the hands is rarely hittable, so I hate seeing a kid rung up on a pitch at the eyes. In & out, I really don't have a problem, as long as it's not more than a couple of balls. When you start taking close pitches with 2 strikes because you think you've figured out the strike zone, you're giving up control of your at bat to the umpire. I don't like the odds of that strategy. |
|
|
|
Bigwhitevan
67 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2013 : 22:05:55
|
Always love this topic. In my opinion, the one in the box is called a batter and not a walker. So hit the pitch, stop looking at good pitches going by because the umpire calls it a ball. Like I tell the kids,the strike zone is imaginary and irrelevant. The thing you should be thinking about is hit or no hit. That being said I would always prefer a wide strike zone on the low side. But I am also the dad of a RH pitcher who loves the cutter!!!!
And it will surprise you what kids can hit with any size bat when they aren't standing in the holes where the rec players stand. One of the things I hate to hear. "but this is where I ALWAYS stand" |
|
|
|
WestCoastGuru
148 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2013 : 07:00:52
|
| I emphasize to be aggressive on the first pitch you see and attack it, and I am always for giving a baseball or two off of the plate.....guess I feel like we were the victim of Eric Gregg's cousin this past weekend, had a parent with a video camera behind the plate this weekend and it's difficult to tell a kid he has to swing at a pitch in the opposite batters box......I don't care what anybody says, can't teach a young man to swing at pitches like that! |
|
|
|
Bigwhitevan
67 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2013 : 08:55:31
|
| West, not knowing your situation. Not trying to imply I do. Just giving you what I see. With the kids getting more and more high velocity movement on pitches, the strike zone becomes whatever the umpire says it is. Unfair or not. Some kids can throw a cutter at one batters box and it ends in the other. This crosses the plate somewhere in between. Factor in where a catcher is setting up in relation to the plate and you get very difficult pitches for an umpire to judge. The youth umpires these days,at least in 12u, have gone more horizontal. Leaning to calling inside off plate or outside off plate. It is difficult to teach a strike zone anymore to hitters. That is why I started telling them "hit or no hit." You can just hope that the pitcher makes a mistake and your hitters are ready to hit it. I am just saying personally I prefer it to be "wide" and not "tall". When a pitcher has to live upstairs eventually the hitter will send it a long way. It does favor the pitcher this way, but these hitters are GOOD!! They will get their hits in. |
|
|
|
F2202
63 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2013 : 04:18:51
|
Strike Zone (NFHS): The strike zone is that space over home plate, the top of which is halfway between the batter's shoulders and the waistline, and the bottom being the knees, when he assumes his natural batting stance. The height of the strike zone is determined by the batter's normal batting stance. If he crouches or leans over to make the shoulder line lower, the umpire determines height by what would be the batter's normal stance.
7-2-1: A strike is charged to the batter when:
a: a pitch enters any part of the strike zone and is not struck at
As an umpire, what do I do with this information. Well first of all, in a varsity game, if I'm calling pitches at the midpoint between the shoulders and waistline, I'm going to hear about it, because that is high. Generally 1-2 baseballs above the belt is about as high as it gets. Bottom of the knee is the low point.
7-2-1a tells me that the ball has to pass through any part of the strike zone. That being said, if the edge of the baseball passes over either edge of the plate, that's defined as a strike. Therefore, I've already got a ball on either side of the plate according to the rule book. Same goes for top/bottom, especially at the knee. I like to work one baseball above the belt, so that the top of my strike zone is really two baseballs above the belt.
In a varsity game I call one more baseball outside, and never hear complaints. Pitchers and catchers love it, batters can go oppo.
As well, a catcher needs to make a pitch look like a strike (rec ball excluded). There is no reason for a catcher to catch a ball and then drag his arm to a different spot. Who's fooled? The parents in the stands. Unfortunately, they don't make the ball/strike decisions. Stick it. You may or may not get a strike out of me if you stick it, but I can promise if it is moved from outside the zone into the zone, you will not get a strike.
As the level of baseball goes down, the strike zone gets bigger. As far as a 12U game goes, they better be ready to swing the bat. The pitcher is going to make plenty of mistakes, but if he knows that every batter on the opposing team is going to take the first strike, he's going to throw it right down the middle.
I can't agree with more with telling batters to be aggressive on the first good pitch to hit. The pitcher will make a mistake, and when he does, punish him for it. This is one aspect that separates the elite teams from everyone else, at every level.
A gentleman I know likes to say, "Nobody walks their way into the Hall of Fame."
|
|
|
|
ChinMusic
126 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2013 : 09:12:16
|
| Good stuff F2202 :cheers: |
|
|
|
bigmcbb
46 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2013 : 09:44:43
|
| F2202: Great "umpire" post. You better believe my son will be reading this one multiple times. Thanks for your insight! |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Strike Zone
