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gatraveler
58 Posts |
 Posted - 07/31/2011 : 09:03:01
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I just wrote 8 paragraphs on this subject. Then I laughed out loud and deleted it.
Coaches think they do a good job. I know because I am one.
Parents think coaches are dictators who only coach so their kid can play short and bat 3rd.
Some truth to both. See you in February! |
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2playersmom
59 Posts |
Posted - 07/31/2011 : 15:10:59
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WOW !
Well Im not a coach or is my husband but you got the descript down on the type coach and his kid player .
Not sure I would want him around PERIOD yet sounds like it has worked well for you (:
Like your rule on big loud overbearing Dad getting thrown out of the park then the kid goes with him for good . Somebodys got to be the good Dad after all .
Too bad some coaches dont have the courage to take your lead on that because that dad is always a cancer & something worse always happens later : it is the poor psych makeup of that type of person , I mean - who is it REALLY that gets thrown out of a baseball park who watched the game in the stands ?!
quote:
Originally posted by neverquit
Getting back to the orginal typic. From my coaching experience you will run into that parent that just wont shut up coaching from the stands, loud self absorbed and non-stop promoter of their child. This type of parent will prevent his child from getting on teams because of him. Yall know the type. We make this self absorb person a ass. coach. You are not going to shut him up from the stands. He does know some coaching. You are short coaches from time to time. You work him and he begins to quite down a little because he is doing the things that need to get done but you dont have the time. He begins to understand. Still a pain but controllable and now tolerable. His son is a very good player but has an attitude like dad. Everybody know his son is not as good as his dad thinks. Now dad can help control little Jonboy at practice. The dad sometimes cant make practice then you have a talk with him. Most parent/coaches come around. Its not easy as they think. Need to get him to quite down further make him keep the book. But keep another set because you know his numbers will be grossly slighted to his child. This has worked for us to help control situations. The only parent that really is low is the one that will slight another kids numbers just so his can look better. Do your best to weed this parent out no matter how good the kid. We always call the other coach before saying you are on the team. Better to have kids learning, getting better and having fun than on a great team that stays tense due to the adults. Every year you have a team implode. My policy is if a parent/coach is thrown out of a game their kids goes with them. Never lost a kid since.
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gasbag
281 Posts |
Posted - 07/31/2011 : 15:32:27
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quote:
Originally posted by baseballfanatic325
Gas. I do coach. Not my son though. So don't ASSume. Never said any of this happened to my kid. Been coaching at all levels up to college for 25 years.
I think if you reread my post, you'll recognize that it is in the form of a question...thus the ? No ASSsumptions here but you avoided the entire question which was and is, why don't you Coach your own son if you are that critical of other Coaches ? Very simple question really ! |
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neverquit
128 Posts |
Posted - 07/31/2011 : 15:56:46
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| I already like you 2playersmom. Im old school. I got dirt in my backyard younger than me. I will not hold a kid responsible for the actions of the parents but I will cut out the cancer. We will develop the kid. He will finish the season with as much playing time and attention as anybody else. After that its time to part ways. I will warn any coach that ask about the parent. |
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ramman999
241 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2011 : 08:32:10
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quote:
Originally posted by excoach12
"Daddy ball" is finally becoming a code phrase for what it has truly meant all along; "I'm mad my kid is not good enough to play constantly where I want him too and instead of facing the reality that he is not going to be a stud but more likely a dud I'm gonna deflect all blame by saying the coaches favor their own kids." Step back, take a look, have you thought "Daddy ball" on more than 1 team?
Never have truer words been posted. It’s always the coaches fault. If every child’s ability matched their parents perception of it, we’d have to double the number of major league teams and colleges!
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baseballready
188 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2011 : 08:57:19
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What if they try to vet the team but some information is withheld? For example, the person "billed" as manager actually handed over coaching control to a late-add coach in order to get his son on the team and planned to not tell other recruits until after offers were accepted. Parents still to blame?
quote:
Originally posted by excoach12
Sorry man but I find it very hard to believe you've coached for 25 years up through college level and asked the questions you did. Anyone who has coached for even 2 years knows the answers to your questions.
Absolutely every answer you gave could be solved by any parent in that position by either leaving the team or starting their own.
If a team were coached as poorly as you portray it would cease to exist after 2 seasons. Parents need to take the responsibility to fully vet a team before committing their child. If they don't, there is no one to blame but the parent.
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rippit
667 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2011 : 09:06:16
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1 - I was going to stay away from the topic just a bit as I can see all sides of the issue. I've seen some parents use the phrases "daddy ball" and "buddy ball" when things didn't go their way. I've seen those same parents get dismissed and not invited back too.
2 - I've seen coaches not play their own kid as much as they should have played him and actually to the detriment of the team. That part just says that some dads are overly sensitive to the issue because of the group in paragraph 1. The group in paragraph 1 NEVER notices or comments about that as long as they are getting their way. I've seen coaches leave teams because of the same group.
3 - I've seen parents cheer ONLY for their son and actually snicker if a good regular makes a mistake. That's just downright sick.
4 - However, it took several years of putting up with the following - what I call "daddy ball" - before figuring out what to do about it: A - from t-ball to minors (5-9ish), only coaches kids played infield positions or pitched or hit in the top of the order. No matter what. Period. And only coaches kids made all stars. Period. Fake tryouts and everything when the all star team had been secretly practicing for weeks. B - from 9ish to not too long ago, coaches who coach or their kid wouldn't get to play much and then they surround their kids with sub-par players to make their kid look better. Also, sick, twisted and doesn't really develop good ball players now does it??
Let's pretend I'm a coach. I want to win, but I also want to help players get better. Otherwise, why coach? This means I'm going to go out and find the very best players who will have me, put a practice schedule together, lay down the law regarding attendance, have them practice they way they are supposed to play and put the best 9 out there on any given day. If a parent comes to me and asks why this or why that or issues any kind of ultimatum, I'll tell them the truth. I won't avoid them or the question. I'll be honest with them and if they don't agree, I'll show them how to find another team that might suit them better. If I happen to have a son on the team, why would I NOT want to surround him with players who will push him to be better?
It's a short road to 9th grade. I'd rather not waste my son's time with such foolishness. Maybe it's an epidemic in our area - I don't know. But I do know that we are in control of our own destiny when deciding where to play and we factor in the players, the coaches and the other parents when making that decision. |
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excoach12
159 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2011 : 10:52:32
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BBReady,
The parents would still be to blame if they did not, immediately upon finding the situation you described, confront those in charge and find out whats going on and why. If they don't like the answer they can leave the team and go elsewhere. Late fall and spring is loaded with players changing teams so there are plenty of openings. |
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baseballfanatic325
19 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2011 : 13:52:45
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| Gas. My bad. I thought you were being sarcastic..... I coached my son until he was 13. Then I focused on my two daughters. I'm not bashing all coaches. Just the ones who are in it for the wrong reasons. Nothing personal. The examples given were just basic. We all know this goes much deeper. I'm surprised ole Jim Shwatz hasn't commented. He and I go back to the ole south ga gym class days. Shwatz where are you?? |
Edited by - baseballfanatic325 on 08/01/2011 14:23:16 |
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BaseballMomof2
57 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2011 : 13:35:27
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| I am the parent of a high school baseball player and wife of a man who coached rec ball and all-stars for several years. I have to admit that I was a bad baseball parent in the early years of my son's baseball experiences. I played the blame game, I gossiped about players/parents/coaches, and I even stooped as low as to yell out from the stands and try to throw an opposing pitcher off during important games. I may have been a coaches worst nightmare at some point over the years (and not just my husband as coach ;). Experiences, good and bad, have brought me to the point that I think I have learned from my mistakes and I am now a parent that the coach does not have to worry about. Having said that, I wish there had been a crystal ball years back that I could have looked at and seen what proper baseball parent behavior should look like. This thread of this website may be the closest thing I have seen to that crystal ball. Love this web-site and am grateful for the advice I find here. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2011 : 14:54:16
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quote:
Originally posted by BaseballMomof2
I am the parent of a high school baseball player and wife of a man who coached rec ball and all-stars for several years. I have to admit that I was a bad baseball parent in the early years of my son's baseball experiences. I played the blame game, I gossiped about players/parents/coaches, and I even stooped as low as to yell out from the stands and try to throw an opposing pitcher off during important games. I may have been a coaches worst nightmare at some point over the years (and not just my husband as coach ;). Experiences, good and bad, have brought me to the point that I think I have learned from my mistakes and I am now a parent that the coach does not have to worry about. Having said that, I wish there had been a crystal ball years back that I could have looked at and seen what proper baseball parent behavior should look like. This thread of this website may be the closest thing I have seen to that crystal ball. Love this web-site and am grateful for the advice I find here.
The difference between going to a HS age game and a 9-12 year old game is like night and day. Once in a blue moon you will get a rowdy group of parents - or a single rowdy parent - but by and large, the older kids games are not the circus that the younger kids games are.
You are not alone in your baseball observer growth BBM2. |
Edited by - bballman on 08/03/2011 16:20:53 |
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reallycoach
64 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 08:57:19
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I once had a parent that was so bad that I had difficulty describing her actions without altercation. I had one of my a friends who was not associated with the team come to a game and tape her and her husband. I gave the DVD to them at the ned of a tournement.
I asked them to watch it and tell me what about the situation taped could be justified.
They took ther son off the team and I never heard from them again. I tried to contact them becuase I didn't want thier son afffected, but never got a response. I later found out that they didn't leave becasue they were embarressed, they left because they felt I was an #$% for taping thier actions. |
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bbmom2
119 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 11:25:32
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quote:
Originally posted by reallycoach
I once had a parent that was so bad that I had difficulty describing her actions without altercation. I had one of my a friends who was not associated with the team come to a game and tape her and her husband. I gave the DVD to them at the end of a tournament.
I asked them to watch it and tell me what about the situation taped could be justified.
They took their son off the team and I never heard from them again. I tried to contact them because I didn't want their son affected, but never got a response. I later found out that they didn't leave because they were embarrassed, they left because they felt I was an #$% for taping their actions.
I'm sure we can write chapter and verse of parents that do not take responsibility for their actions any more than these same parents are the ones that bad mouth the coaches and can't understand why Johnny isn't hitting up and playing more. Good for you really coach! Had I been on your team I would have applauded and said good riddance. You are right that you hate for the parents behavior to affect the child but it does.... bad parent behavior affects ALL players - not just the ones that have the bad parents.
I made a statement in the Baseball Moms forum that I don't want to be one of those "ugh she's here" parents. Like you - baseballmomof2 - I learned the hard way that while it's "fun" to be in the know of the goings on of a travel ball team, it's far more "fun" to be a good parent and relax and enjoy the ride. I don't get involved in the politics and gossip and if I have a problem with the coach - you know what - my son will be playing 14 this year - if he's not bothered enough to talk to coach himself, then I will let it go. Watched a team disintegrate a couple of years ago due to behavior problems with a player, inconsistent coaching and parents that just fed off it. Won't go there again.
Plus, if really coach has his camera out - don't want to be the star!  |
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Card6
152 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 11:38:15
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| If I had known it to be that easy I would have been recording long ago. Thanks for the tip. Problem with those parents is the apple doesnt fall far from the tree. You made the team better. Our friend said they had no intention of taking one of their better players back because of the parents. Some parents are just so blind that they are the reason their kid wont be playing. |
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spliter
121 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 12:23:11
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quote:
Originally posted by bbmom2
I'm sure we can write chapter and verse of parents that do not take responsibility for their actions any more than these same parents are the ones that bad mouth the coaches and can't understand why Johnny isn't hitting up and playing more. Good for you really coach!
No matter if Little Johnny is the stud that dads a dud. Reallycoach said they tried to tell them. These people wont listen but a picture tells a thousand words. Besides Johnny may be good on the field but I bet he doesnt have many friends on the team and thats what it about. They are all about them and his stats. IE. Our fall ball jerseys came in. One player got there first and got a number that was already assigned to a player and he and the parent knew this. When the boy ask why do you have my jersey. The bully said I did it because I knew it would @#k$ you off. Wrong thing to say and do to the coaches son. Short season for them. It got around now the kid will have a hard time finding a team in the park. ps Im charging my camera now. |
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reallycoach
64 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 12:52:58
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The camera has cured a number of issues. The " I didn't say that" is alwaysw funny. It has caught out of control coaches, parents, players and umps.
I don't coach anymore, but besides the halrious actions caught, it was the evidense to remove at least one coach and have one upm removed from a tournement. So now when I go to the ballpark, which I do alot, I always take my camera.... |
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neverquit
128 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 17:06:06
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| Some parents are just that immature. I was at football practice in cobb a lady who doesnt know me or know that I am best friends with their x baseball coach was talking about her baseball experience. She named the man who told her that their x baseball coach had his team takin away and kicked out of the park. This couldnt be further from the truth. I wish I had it on video. Instead of telling her friend is possibly upset because they will not be back in the park due to parent issues I though I would let her find out just how wrong they are next week. |
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bbmom2
119 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2011 : 17:35:07
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quote:
Originally posted by reallycoach
The camera has cured a number of issues. The " I didn't say that" is always funny. It has caught out of control coaches, parents, players and umps.
I don't coach anymore, but besides the hilarious actions caught, it was the evidence to remove at least one coach and have one ump removed from a tournament. So now when I go to the ballpark, which I do a lot, I always take my camera....
So lesson here is... smile... you may be on candid camera! |
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coachdan06
433 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2011 : 01:31:58
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Oh Man is that funny !!
nice work coach even back in Dan's day they said pictures dont lie
i remember back some years when coupla parents didnt like that their boy wasnt star of the team - there was a reason he wasnt star of the team of course but theyre the only ones who couldnt understand it
so they sat right behind the screen and took written notes of everything the coach would do and didnt do , they looked so pathetic doing this and again theyre the only ones who couldnt see that !
but here - you were a parent that mom and dad badly needed to scold themselves !
and it worked
quote:
Originally posted by reallycoach
I once had a parent that was so bad that I had difficulty describing her actions without altercation. I had one of my a friends who was not associated with the team come to a game and tape her and her husband. I gave the DVD to them at the ned of a tournement.
I asked them to watch it and tell me what about the situation taped could be justified.
They took ther son off the team and I never heard from them again. I tried to contact them becuase I didn't want thier son afffected, but never got a response. I later found out that they didn't leave becasue they were embarressed, they left because they felt I was an #$% for taping thier actions.
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Houndfan
42 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2011 : 09:45:14
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I work as a scout for a Big League club and I got a call last night from the father of a kid I was involved in signing. His son is a fringe player, he projects to possibly High A ball. Good head on his shoulders but some flaws mechanically. He was a pretty good player in HS and grew in JC and then 1 year in college.
The call last night was an amalgam of what I have read in this string. Dad is still coaching him! It is my fault nee the coaches in his current assignment, the scouting department for the organization, etc etc that his son is not playing significant innings right now. I've developed a relationship with the father so I spent some time trying to explain the situation that the son is in now. This is big boy ball and he's only been in the organization for a couple of weeks. Anyway, the call ended on a bad note with the dad over valuing his son.
I don't know specifically why the kid is not playing, but I can suspect that if he has the same entitlement issues as Dad that may be a good start. Sometimes Dads, and I am included on this with my own son, need to understand their ability and potential. In this case, dad needs to be grateful that he was drafted regardless of how low and thankful that his son is in a position to learn. There are a lot of guys that are projected like this kid who see some Big League time. They are humble, hardworking, and accept the reality of their skills and bust their butts to reach their dreams... |
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Rachel.11
1 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2011 : 14:07:59
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| i agree |
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dirtdiamond
24 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2011 : 18:33:15
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Love the link on Rasmus' dad. I don't coach from the stands though and never will. I don't have time to get my own team and don't want the work that goes with it. That is for the coaches. This is the problem I have with all the crazy recruiting tactics going on and posted about them in the 11U board. Crazy I tell you.
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Originally posted by in_the_know
Ummmm, never. Google "Colby Rasmus Dad"
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/28/of-course-colby-rasmus-dad-ripped-tony-la-russa-yesterday/
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When do parents stop bothering coaches.....
