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4 seam
46 Posts |
 Posted - 10/06/2010 : 11:36:30
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Get a group of boys and develop them into baseball players. I get a kick out of coaches that have to "recruit" so the coach can win and look good. If you were a good coach you should be able to get a group of kids with average baseball skills and make that team great.
In todays world coaches want the easy way out and get kids that are already great.
Parents beware...I have been around travel baseball for 7 years and I have seen kids with great skills become worse every year because they get on teams trying to win instead of developing players. I understand that you want to face top pitchers, but believe me, we live in a baseball rich state and their are great pitchers in all levels. And remember, fast does not make great...I see these major teams that cannot hit a 47 mph pitch but can drill 55-60 all day long. As they get older they will not see fast ball after fast ball. Get with a coach that will make them better not with a recruiter that can't coach! |
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Spartan4
913 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 12:15:55
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| I think there are more than enough threads on this topic........Bobby Cox couldn't turn a team with AA talent into even a low major team. That is another reason you see the recruiting every year, parents get tired of having their son play on a team with 3-4 other players that make the plays, get timely hits, and share the load of pitching. And if you go back to the last thread you can see some more conversation on your theory of fast ball after fast ball.....Most boys(not all) at the AA/AAA level throw the fastball a majority of the time(as they should) where the major teams so often curves and other breaking pitches almost 50% of the time. And believe it or not the whole "get a group of boys and develop them" thought is relatively new. When I was growing up travel ball consisted of 12-18 teams per age group, there were no classifications to speak of and every team out there could realistically beat any other team out there. Now travel ball has become VERY VERY watered down as every kid who is successful during his time at rec ball or all-stars is instantly travel ball material and then finds a team. Parents are also ALWAYS looking to put their son with better players so I don't think all the blame can be placed on the coaches either. Some coaches will say they don't recruit, or recruiting doesn't matter but every year these same coaches will add/drop players. It is the only way to stay on top.... |
Edited by - Spartan4 on 10/06/2010 13:10:03 |
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Scott0923
49 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 12:20:24
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| 4seam Tell us how you really feel...LOL |
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SSBuckeye
575 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 12:42:46
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| Nice post. That's why I got into this racket to begin with. Picked local boys I knew from baseball, football or some other connection with the hopes that we could build them up over several years. After one year, I would say we're on track. Personally, I enjoy the process of watching kids do things they couldn't do before. I enjoy that more than if I had a team of already-polished players where all I had to do was roll the ball out on the field and we'd win. There are teams like that, for sure, but it's not what our team is about. I've said it before, so long as everyone on each team is aligned with the goals that the team's coaches sets, there is no right or wrong way to build a team. We do it one way, but it doesn't make us more right than someone else. |
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SSBuckeye
575 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 13:55:46
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Spartan, you seem to make a lot of statements that are absolutes....parents ALWAYS look for better teams.....recruiting is the only way to stay on top....AA/AAA boys throw all fastballs.....etc. I don't think it's that black and white. I guarantee you that I have 3-4 boys that could play on a top-level ECB team. None of those families even considered making that move for next year, even though ECB is only 30 minutes away for most families in our area.
I certainly believe you're reflecting your own experiences, but I can say with 100% certainty that there are teams who do look at things differently than do you. I don't believe there's one way to do this, and each family needs to join a team that aligns with their own objectives. Everything you say makes it clear you want to be on the best team possible. That's cool. Nothing wrong with that. But there are other considerations that others find even more important, which is why it's wrong-minded to make such blanket statements about why people play travel baseball in Georgia. |
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MadSkills
128 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 14:51:28
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quote:
Originally posted by 4 seam
Get a group of boys and develop them into baseball players. I get a kick out of coaches that have to "recruit" so the coach can win and look good. If you were a good coach you should be able to get a group of kids with average baseball skills and make that team great.
In todays world coaches want the easy way out and get kids that are already great.
Parents beware...I have been around travel baseball for 7 years and I have seen kids with great skills become worse every year because they get on teams trying to win instead of developing players. I understand that you want to face top pitchers, but believe me, we live in a baseball rich state and their are great pitchers in all levels. And remember, fast does not make great...I see these major teams that cannot hit a 47 mph pitch but can drill 55-60 all day long. As they get older they will not see fast ball after fast ball. Get with a coach that will make them better not with a recruiter that can't coach!
4seam,
As far as the kids that don't improve, is it development or the fact that they have not gotten any bigger or stronger? I've noticed several players who were studs at 8 or 9 having the same velocity as they do now at age 11. Those kids who dominated at 8 or 9 are now role players, in some cases it can be coaching or the kids lack of work ethic.
And regarding your other point, I wish it were that easy but in Atlanta a good player can have several offers from teams so trying to keep a team together can be very difficult just from the pull from outside. |
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Spartan4
913 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 17:56:14
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Not one-minded to the way people play travel baseball in Georgia....Just saying the way a majority of the major teams do things. I didn't say ALWAYS throw fastballs I said it is a majority fastballs, and from our limited experience with AAA that was exactly what we saw. And I can't think of one major team who didn't make any upgrades after the season was over in 10s, 11s and 12s. Certainly every team that finished in the top of the Elite 32 or the NYBC has made additions and cut players that didn't fit going forward. It was just giving an opinion from the major side of it, also just my opinion. And you are right, a majority of the AA/AAA teams don't recruit...Those teams have less to gain if the weaker players are still on the team, also IMO those teams are less likely to attract the big pitchers who would rather have the best possible defense and lineup behind them. Many of these boys also enjoy the big end of the year world series tourneys and playing with different boys, recruiting some boys allows them to play multiple world series events. And the fact that you don't have any parents wanting to leave is awesome, and I think that definitely shows you have done a good job with your boys and their families. And I agree with you 100% that there is no right or wrong way to do things, as long as the entire team has a similar goal and all expectations are discussed up front. But there are multiple posts from multiple people talking negatively on recruiting or replacing kids, I don't think its that black or white either. Teams can have many different reasons to replace kids, and to find the best possible kid I will go way out on a limb and say is to target the best kids you saw in the previous season, or a kid that has tools that you as a coach feel you can develop.
Also, playing with the best team isn't what we were after, our option for best team was over 3 hours away with the team having no practices. That team will surely be as good as ever but I DO want mine to practice and play with a team. What we weren't looking for is for a team that was going to duck the big tourneys, or telling half the parents this team is a top major team only to sign up as AAA which we have had a problem with in the past. A lot of coaches will say whatever they think a parent/player needs to hear to get them. |
Edited by - Spartan4 on 10/06/2010 19:51:20 |
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4 seam
46 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 21:23:15
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I don't think it is teams always dodging the big tournaments....I think head coaches do not want to pay the large tournament fees associated with the so called "big tournaments" This is getting out of control, the cost is ridiculous!
I have seen the opposite happened from what a early post said "kids are the same player they were at age 8 because they haven't grown" I have a son that is a late bloomer, he was wanted at age 7 & 8, but at 9 & 10 not wanted, and now at 11 wanted because he finally has grown and got stronger. A Lot of coaches (dads) want talent not kids to coach up!
To each his own and good luck to all the teams and remember let the kids be kids and if they can play they will play in high school no matter if they played AA/AAA/Major! |
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SSBuckeye
575 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2010 : 22:47:14
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| Fair enough, Sparty! Enjoyed the dialogue! |
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Bogart
10 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2010 : 08:18:53
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| SS, are you saying that you didn't drop players or add players from the prior year and all the parents are happy. I think that is great and you must be doing the right thing. I saw you team play a few times and they looked very good |
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SSBuckeye
575 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2010 : 10:31:05
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| Bogart, we had 10 players last year, and we picked up 2 new boys for the upcoming season and 2 boys left. Hope I didn't imply that we had no turnover, that seems to be a part of the process every year. I certainly won't discuss on an open forum why the two boys left, but all parties agreed it was in the best interests of the boys involved. I still see the parents around town, and everyone is happy. Both boys are playing on new teams, and we even played one of those teams over the weekend. Thanks for the compliment on our team! |
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Bogart
10 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2010 : 13:01:30
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| SS, kids are going to leave a team for what ever reason. Keeping 10 is still very good with all the new teams this year. Great job |
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