| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| rippit |
Posted - 05/15/2011 : 13:10:29
Gotta vent. 
Roster batting, kid (last batted out pinch running for catcher) gets hurt diving back to first in the middle of the game. Has to come out and the original runner goes back in.
?????????(I'm confused already.)
Game goes on and injured kid's turn in the order is coming up. Coach goes to clarify the rule about what happens if he can't complete his at bat with the HP ump who hasn't a clue and who then goes to talk to the field ump about whether this player will be an auto out if he misses his turn to bat bc of injury. Wastes 5 minutes deciding it would be an out. TD watching the whole thing. Kid's turn comes up and he sucks it up and goes to the plate. Gets a bloop single and limps toward first. Opposing coach then comes out and wastes another 5 minutes arguing that the kid CAN'T come back in after the umpire says he can either hit or take the out (time about to expire, we are down by one with guy on and 2 outs) and continues this stall tactic BUSH junk while TD continues to watch the whole thing. Next batter K's and the end result of 10 minutes of frickin discussion over a simple RULE means game over. I find this bogus.
If umpires are getting PAID they should know their stuff and not ruin a good game by letting time run out because they don't know what they are doing. TD should have stepped in and allowed the last inning to be played.
OH - and I need to add that the beeper on the umps timer went off a full 20 seconds AFTER the last out and both teams were in their respective dugouts and our catcher running toward homeplate. As a matter of fact, he was walking toward the field ump, heard the timer go off, walked back and then called ballgame. BOGUS!! |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| baseballdreams |
Posted - 06/29/2011 : 10:35:08
quote:
Originally posted by brannonp
What about umps being use in a state torney or final 4. That don't know the rules or have a strike zone. You ask a question and they say oh I didn't know that. you play hard all season to get there just to have them throw rookies out there at least put one vetran with them not both who have know ideal.
I understand exactly how you feel most of us got into travel ball to take it to the next level. And when you go to state to play the best teams in the state pay your entry fee and a $7.00 gate fee you expect the fields to be in best of shape umpires to be top notch. This did not happen at the P.T.C. state tournament they did not even supply game balls. |
| brannonp |
Posted - 06/27/2011 : 19:02:41
What about umps being use in a state torney or final 4. That don't know the rules or have a strike zone. You ask a question and they say oh I didn't know that. you play hard all season to get there just to have them throw rookies out there at least put one vetran with them not both who have know ideal. |
| ddhubbart |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 07:59:04
I can't believe the water thing would even be a question? I have seen the good, bad and the ugly when it comes to umpires. The only ones I ever have a problem with are the beligerent ones. I have seen some games where the umps were not the best but they were having a good time with the kids. It's more productive to teach the kids that the umpires are not the enemy but part of the game. |
| rustybucket |
Posted - 06/15/2011 : 16:38:22
That's what I was thinking too. The ump was a kid, prolly just out of high school, maybe college. I could tell he was cooking in all that gear. |
| touchemall |
Posted - 06/15/2011 : 16:32:56
Not good for an ump to pass out in front of kids (spooks them pretty bad) so we offer them water and shade in our dugout between innings. I don't see anything wrong with it. It is just the right thing to do. |
| gatoremt |
Posted - 06/15/2011 : 13:57:00
I always use the teams water cooler or get water from the concession stand. |
| reallycoach |
Posted - 06/14/2011 : 17:33:08
No you didn't. The safty of the umps is just as important as anyone on the field. Offering water is a common courtesy.
BTW, if a coach or fan gets personal, I say pull the trigger. questioning calls, rulings; just part of the game. Getting personal is a ticket out of the park. |
| mjones9226 |
Posted - 06/14/2011 : 17:05:30
NEVER make it personel or bereate someone as an individual. There is a right way to argue a call. I think you should always be hospitible to an official, and offering them water or anything else they need is the right thing to do. Handling yourself the right way in both instances is what young men need to see. |
| christheump |
Posted - 06/14/2011 : 16:08:26
Personally, I appreciate it. It is not bad. I try to bring my own to the field, but sometimes I go right through them. I've seen all levels, including MLB umps(albiet bottled water) get that. It is just really a courtesy IMO. |
| rustybucket |
Posted - 06/14/2011 : 14:19:23
All I'm trying to say, I guess, is that you can have an argument/disagreement without belittling or berating or personally attacking an ump.
I'll be the first one to admit that a manager/ump confrontation is as part of the game as hot dogs and pickles. But coaches and fans that persist after the call (sometimes for several innings) and take it to a personal level and try to berate the ump.
While I've got you, christheump, is it considered bad/good to offer an ump access to your team water cooler? It was 100deg the other day and the ump looked parched, I offered and he obliged but the assistant coach looked at me like I had lost my mind.... I've been out of the game for a while, did I make a faux pas? |
| christheump |
Posted - 06/14/2011 : 11:57:39
quote:
Originally posted by rustybucket
It is human nature to make mistakes. Everyone on the baseball field makes mistakes throughout the course of the game.... Players, Coaches, Parents and yes, Umps...
Why is it that it's ok to scream and haggle with the ump? What if your shortstop bobbled a ball and it cost you a run, do you shoot out onto the field yelling at him? Do you scream at him how his blown play just cost your team the game and how he needs to get some glasses so he can see the ball next time?
When you, as a coach, put a DH in and the DH strikes out, does the kid who you replaced come back screaming at you about how bad of a coaching decision that was? What if you call for a steal on a pitch-out, does the base runner run over and berate you telling you you need glasses b/c the pitchout sign was SOOOOO obvious your 90yr old mother could have seen it???
All that said, I do think that some haggling with the ump is just part of the game, but I think most coaches (and all parents) take it WAAAAAAAY too far.
btw, umps are just here to do a job. What if you made a typo and your boss came into your office screaming at you... how would that make you feel? I know umps are supposed to have thick skin, but cmon guys, you have to cut them a break here and there.
Many parents and coaches would say it is part of the job and we get paid for it and if we dont like the screaming to quit. But I still love doing it regardless of what is said to me. |
| rustybucket |
Posted - 06/14/2011 : 08:21:42
It is human nature to make mistakes. Everyone on the baseball field makes mistakes throughout the course of the game.... Players, Coaches, Parents and yes, Umps...
Why is it that it's ok to scream and haggle with the ump? What if your shortstop bobbled a ball and it cost you a run, do you shoot out onto the field yelling at him? Do you scream at him how his blown play just cost your team the game and how he needs to get some glasses so he can see the ball next time?
When you, as a coach, put a DH in and the DH strikes out, does the kid who you replaced come back screaming at you about how bad of a coaching decision that was? What if you call for a steal on a pitch-out, does the base runner run over and berate you telling you you need glasses b/c the pitchout sign was SOOOOO obvious your 90yr old mother could have seen it???
All that said, I do think that some haggling with the ump is just part of the game, but I think most coaches (and all parents) take it WAAAAAAAY too far.
btw, umps are just here to do a job. What if you made a typo and your boss came into your office screaming at you... how would that make you feel? I know umps are supposed to have thick skin, but cmon guys, you have to cut them a break here and there. |
| gatoremt |
Posted - 06/10/2011 : 17:32:54
As a umpire we do have off days on the field. There are some days behind the plate I feel like I cannot get anything right. On getting good umps, here is a thought. Most tourneys put the umps up in 2 bedrooms for 12 umps. Then they expect them to umpire 3 to 5 games a day. That is a lot for any umpire. So with the heat from working the games the guys get tired and things happen. There is never an excuse for screwing up rules, but here is one thing to remember. Most of us umpire’s, ump many different levels and leagues from LL, Cal Ripken, Babe Ruth, Dizzy Dean, USSSA, NFHS, JUCO, and NCAA just to post a few. Each has there on set of rules. Each park and tourney we do has their own version of rules for us to follow. So it can get confusing. It is hard to completely ignore the fans. Us umps have feelings to you know. I always try to get all the calls correct, but that is not going to happen. I have a very slow trigger for throwing people out of games.
On the strike zone there is a text book version and every umpire will give you a different answer. I have always worked the Slot. The people in the stands do not understand a lot of the times the strike is called at the plate not where the catcher catches the ball. So when your catcher is setting up deep it is going to look like something different. There are so many factors that go into umpiring. I would challenge all to just go and umpire for a couple of months and you will have a different view. Most umpires that go and do travel ball also do High School or college baseball. We are test every year and monitored often by our associations. You are always going to have a few bad apples that slip in thou. Just my 2 cents thou.
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| Spartan4 |
Posted - 06/03/2011 : 23:42:37
I get sick and tired of seeing the better pitcher get squeezed.....It happens ALOT!! Usually the kid who throws hard has to throw thru a straw to get a strike and the kid who throws really slow can't miss. It doesn't happen every game but it happens at least once a weekend where we have a game with a ridiculously inconsistent strike zones, but you have to teach boys to adjust and learn to cope with the zone even if it is tight OR if it happens to be wide open! |
| christheump |
Posted - 06/03/2011 : 16:30:41
Never even things up. No way no how. |
| momshell |
Posted - 06/03/2011 : 15:09:33
My boys both pitch well, and many times this year we have had times when their strike zone is the size of a dinner plate and the opposing(not good) pitcher has a noticeably larger one. One of mine catches too and has seen this a lot. He is very respectful of the umps we have, but this problem has really changed the way he feels about them. DO umps "even things up" at times? We have had some really close games this year that would have been different if both sides were called consistently. |
| DecaturDad |
Posted - 06/03/2011 : 11:37:50
quote:
Originally posted by nwgadad
Consistancy is all we ask for. A lot of us fans will say, at least he is calling it on both sides! Whether it is right or wrong, just make it the same for both teams! 
My son was catching a game earlier this year. After a few innings I asked him where the strike zone was. His answer: "I have no idea" :-) To be fair, that was just one event. We played this past weekend with a younger ump. I really thought is was going to be a long day. But he did a great job. I did not agree with 100% of his calls, then then most are subjective. I was talking to the head ump later in the day, and mentioned how good I thought he was.
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| nwgadad |
Posted - 06/03/2011 : 10:09:02
quote:
Originally posted by christheump
Yes, strike zones do vary from ump to ump, it even happens at the MLB level. The key is just be consistent.
Consistancy is all we ask for. A lot of us fans will say, at least he is calling it on both sides! Whether it is right or wrong, just make it the same for both teams! |
| christheump |
Posted - 06/03/2011 : 08:40:51
Some umps are taught to work the slot and some are taught to work differently. I have tried the slot, and personally can not stand it. The slot is the void position between the catcher and batter. I have tried it and I will admit, I had a hard time with the outside pitch with it. Others have told me, it just takes getting use to. But like I said, I couldn't stand it. I tend to work directly behind the catcher with my head slightly offset over either shoulder. The reason I like working like this is if the catcher sets up inside, I adjust to the outside shoulder and vice versa which usually give me good coverage of the enitre plate, up/down, in/out. The only downside to working like this is you do tend to get blasted with fouls that come shooting straight back at ya. But those are easy to deal with...Just dont turn your head, you have a mask-use it.
Another thing is relative distance. "Most" umps with give some on the outside, say a ball off. Sometimes that ball off may look like 6-12 inches off the plate, but it usually isnt, but it does happen.
Some of the most over-used synonyms:
1. Letter high breaking ball : That was at his eyes.
2. Inside pitch : That almost hit him.
3. Painting the outside with a perfect fastball : That was a mile outside.
4. Fastball at the knees : That was at his shoe strings.
Yes, strike zones do vary from ump to ump, it even happens at the MLB level. The key is just be consistent. |
| Jacked-up |
Posted - 06/02/2011 : 16:49:53
This should qualify for another subject, but can get it started here...
Why are umps strike zones soooo different? I typically sit right behind home plate or slightly off to one side. I see catchers line-up in the other batters box and catch the pitch perfectly as if over middle of the plate. Ump calls a strike but the ball is clearly 6 inches to a foot wide. This is at the major level so there is a higher expectation of play by both players and umps.
So UMPs out there, what/how are you taught to call strikes? |
| Spartan4 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 17:41:35
LOL, nope!! We had a lefty do a double move similar to the first-third move a RH pitcher would do. It was clearly a balk and it was the tying run so I made the comment that once the pitcher disengages the rubber he becomes a fielder!! Surprisingly both umpires convened and came to the conclusion that I must be correct......One of the other coaches was PISSED!!!!
We had a boy dive across the line playing 3b and couldn't catch the ball but the ball was called fair. Apparently according to this wonderful umpire at EC, "if any part of the fielders body is in fair territory then the ball will be deemed fair.....he even said 1000% of the time"!!! Of course the other umpire told him he was wrong, but it had us laughing for awhile!! |
| christheump |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 15:09:32
quote:
Originally posted by Spartan4
I enjoy hearing your opinion and your side Chris, I think we all agree that we appreciate a little hustle out of officials in all sports. And I can absoultely agree with Morris that part of being an umpire should be simply knowing the rules, I have argued with umpires before and just made something up they went along with. Laughed about it the whole way home!! It was funny but it should NEVER happen!!
Were you the one that was trying to tell me that because the fielder had both feet in fair territory and the ball was in foul, it was a fair ball??  |
| Dr. Old School |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 15:04:08
I wish we could just get fans sitting in the stands, that don't know the rules or the strategy of baseball, to be quiet and enjoy watching the game. It is amazing how many fans want to spout off stuff out loud and are competely wrong.
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| Spartan4 |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 15:01:21
I enjoy hearing your opinion and your side Chris, I think we all agree that we appreciate a little hustle out of officials in all sports. And I can absoultely agree with Morris that part of being an umpire should be simply knowing the rules, I have argued with umpires before and just made something up they went along with. Laughed about it the whole way home!! It was funny but it should NEVER happen!! |
| mstimpson |
Posted - 06/01/2011 : 14:29:51
I agree that there has to be a level of respect and civility between umpires and coaches. When coaches and fans cross that line, throw them out. I hate that some of the good ones have been run off. However, those that remain have to know what they are getting in to and decide whether or not they can be objective and fair. I am only asking that the umpires simply know the rules!
Consistent with what Allstar and Spartan4 mentioned, the best umpires we have had this year, have been those that do not engage coaches and fans. If they sense things are getting out of hand, they go to both coaches and issue warnings. Any more after the warnings warrants ejections, nothing more nothing less that is it. |
