| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Blue |
Posted - 08/24/2010 : 14:00:11
I'd love to hear opinions on this. What age does a kid "have to" play travel baseball? I've heard people say if a kid stays in rec ball "too long" they won't be looked at for travel ball, no matter how good they are. I've heard other people say if you start them too young they burn out or worse, get injured. I've seen posts from teams looking for players but requiring "2 years travel ball experience". Some parents are simply horrified at the idea of their boy playing rec ball beyond the age of 9.
Is it awful to let a kid play rec ball until they are 12 or 13? Will they be overlooked simply because they stayed in rec ball? |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| leftyrightyecb |
Posted - 09/03/2010 : 11:33:47
That ad for the 3U is funny Juice. Took me a minute to figure the contact name out but it says to contact Hall and Oates (Holland Oates). |
| jongamefan |
Posted - 09/03/2010 : 10:32:18
Nice observation Coach , not surprising
quote:
Originally posted by coachdan06
watching this board is a topic close to my interest as an
oldtime old school guy.
i looked at the 11 year old Astros 2007 as an example to compare to 15 year old teams today as high school kids
of the 15 listed according to usssa only 5 or 6 are still evn playing the game competitively and none of them are still with the Astros .
a strong argument that a boy who joins at 11 dont mean anything even in the short run
|
| Alter-Ego |
Posted - 09/03/2010 : 06:32:20
Coachdb007,
My instruction has always been free. Charging for it would make it "work" and take all the fun out of it. 
If people are going to pay, make sure you see, in writing, the instructors bio. It can't just all be from someone who read stuff in books and is trying to teach. Their coaching experience must have some successful experience in older age groups as well. An instructor that has not coached at the older age groups is typically going to have a hard time developing players for that level. Getting instruction should be for future levels as much as it is for your current level. |
| coachdan06 |
Posted - 09/03/2010 : 00:46:06
watching this board is a topic close to my interest as an
oldtime old school guy.
i looked at the 11 year old Astros 2007 as an example to compare to 15 year old teams today as high school kids
of the 15 listed according to usssa only 5 or 6 are still evn playing the game competitively and none of them are still with the Astros .
a strong argument that a boy who joins at 11 dont mean anything even in the short run |
| 6bomber |
Posted - 09/02/2010 : 22:33:05
juice i saw it and almost signed up. little did i know. |
| Juice11 |
Posted - 09/02/2010 : 10:15:14
http://i43.tinypic.com/344piyf.jpg
Saw this posted at the local batting cage... It was a JOKE!
|
| bosox04 |
Posted - 08/27/2010 : 09:01:14
Pay attention to your kids and you'll probably get the answer from them and you'll know when it's time. Both my boys were bored with rec ball at a young age and wanted to be challenged more. We're not trying to make it to the pros just trying to learn life's lessons on the way. My 9yr old learned what hard work does from travel ball, he brought that into school and got straight A's last term. (Wouldn't have got that from rec ball.)
The only other thing I'll add is that no matter how athletic they are, they need good instruction every step of the way, it's a game of continually developing skills and mechanics, unless your son is the next Jason Heyward. |
| Whitlow |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 21:22:59
quote:
Originally posted by biged
No AGE is good. Quit while you still have a life. Once you start travel ball it is over. All your money and time will be consumed.
- so true, but it gives you something to do with your son and you can reminisce after all the money is gone!
It really depends on the rec program I think NYO and Buckhead Park have good rec programs that play a lot of travel. Also larger Parks are more competitive because of the number of kids. I think in the past 12U was the age to start travel, but I think it is better to start at 9U if that is where all the AllStars are going. If I had to do over again I maybe would have started my son in pre-tee ball. They need a breaks though or another sport as well. It also depends on where they are going to get the best coaching as well as competition.
|
| excoach12 |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 20:11:47
cop is right.
The part of baseball my son liked the most was seeing improvement in himself. Learning a skill he did not have before and then executing it in a game.
He becomes a better ball player by playing WITH better players and AGAINST better players.
He was the best player on his rec team for 3 years in a row, always the first kid picked in the draft room, and always on the all-star team and he just was not challenged his last year in rec ball. He became fed up with kids not showing up, kids who didn't care whether they were there or not and kids who just couldn't make a simple play. We went to travel last year and all of a sudden he was not the best on the team. That made him work harder to become the best. This year we've moved to a major team where he is back to being in the middle of the pack and will challenge him for the next couple years. |
| coachdb007 |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 19:58:57
Alter sounds like you have all the knowlege to instruct. How about $55 an hour? |
| cop311 |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 17:17:06
One thing no one mentioned is that all rec programs are not created equal. While it is true if a kid has the skills they can make a travel team at 12-13-14. I wonder how many kids who had the talent at 8-9-10 quit baseball at 11-12 because it's not much fun to have 6 kids show up to practice, teams with kids who are first time players, and unable to work on more advanced skills. I knows my son was very frustrated at his 9 year old rec experience so we left at 10. Going to a travel team may be what some kids need to keep their interests up. Just a thought. |
| Hurricane |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 16:07:15
I agree Alter-Ego excellent point, if you don't see improvment then time to try someone else.
|
| coachdan06 |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 15:38:41
quote:
Originally posted by biged
No AGE is good. Quit while you still have a life. Once you start travel ball it is over. All your money and time will be consumed.
|
| Alter-Ego |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 14:24:45
Hurricane,
I completely agree that there are some instructors out there that are doing a dis-service to the kids they are instructing. That is the research that has to go into the process when finding the right instructor. If a person has not proven to be an experienced player (College and above) or proven to be a very successful coach or instructor developing players, don't spend $50/hr taking lessons from them. (Not that being an experienced player is an auto pass to being a good instructor. Just because you can do something does not mean you can teach it.)
Do your homework.
I see a lot of instructors that teach a lot of things wrong. If after 2 or 3 months, when your son does work outside of lessons, you don't see improvements in that skill, I would suggest evaluating if you are getting your money's worth. |
| Hurricane |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 13:23:50
What you will see is the better athletes will go farther in baseball regardless of what they do before age 12. Good Reps bad reps it doesn't really matter (look at some of Dominicans) what it comes down too is how well they run and how strong their arms are. |
| G-Man |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 12:34:05
I agree with that but this is why you must do your research before using a particular instructor. Just because someone played in the Minors or Majors doesnt mean they know how to instruct. I know a lot of guys that were very good hitters in the pros but cant relay to a student how to do the same thing.
The point with my comment was to suggest that its never too early to start a child learning proper mechanics for any particular baseball skill. Its all about the muscle memory and only time and practice is going to help.
quote:
Originally posted by Hurricane
quote:
Originally posted by G-Man
I disagree with this statement. In my humble opinion it is never a waste to get a player good quality instruction. Everything baseball is about muscle memory. Dad watching other players mechanically and then trying to teach this to their child could cause bad habits to be developed. There are much finer points within certain mechanical aspects of baseball that unless you are very familar with them, you may miss seeing them unless you know what to look for. Hense you may give your child only half of that mechanical tool to work that particular baseball skill and possibly create bad mechanics that will take longer to repair.
Muscle memory takes about 1400 to 1600 hours to develope. Bad muscle memory takes almost double that to break. So why not give a player the complete proper way to perform a baseball skill as early as possible by a trained professional coach.
There are still many instructors and coaches out there giving bad information some more than dad. They think they know what goes on in a baseball swing and don't have a clue.
Squish the bug, I still hear major coaches telling players this and it kills me.
|
| biged |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 12:17:57
No AGE is good. Quit while you still have a life. Once you start travel ball it is over. All your money and time will be consumed. |
| Hurricane |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 11:26:59
quote:
Originally posted by G-Man
I disagree with this statement. In my humble opinion it is never a waste to get a player good quality instruction. Everything baseball is about muscle memory. Dad watching other players mechanically and then trying to teach this to their child could cause bad habits to be developed. There are much finer points within certain mechanical aspects of baseball that unless you are very familar with them, you may miss seeing them unless you know what to look for. Hense you may give your child only half of that mechanical tool to work that particular baseball skill and possibly create bad mechanics that will take longer to repair.
Muscle memory takes about 1400 to 1600 hours to develope. Bad muscle memory takes almost double that to break. So why not give a player the complete proper way to perform a baseball skill as early as possible by a trained professional coach.
There are still many instructors and coaches out there giving bad information some more than dad. They think they know what goes on in a baseball swing and don't have a clue.
Squish the bug, I still hear major coaches telling players this and it kills me. |
| G-Man |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 11:06:24
I disagree with this statement. In my humble opinion it is never a waste to get a player good quality instruction. Everything baseball is about muscle memory. Dad watching other players mechanically and then trying to teach this to their child could cause bad habits to be developed. There are much finer points within certain mechanical aspects of baseball that unless you are very familar with them, you may miss seeing them unless you know what to look for. Hense you may give your child only half of that mechanical tool to work that particular baseball skill and possibly create bad mechanics that will take longer to repair.
Muscle memory takes about 1400 to 1600 hours to develope. Bad muscle memory takes almost double that to break. So why not give a player the complete proper way to perform a baseball skill as early as possible by a trained professional coach.
quote:
Originally posted by bigcatsdad
Honestly, it is 12 or 13 as several have stated. Hopefully each player will build upon each year and peak at 17-18 when it really matters. Before 12, you're probably wasting money with lessons that you as a parent can teach by watching others and with enough repetitions.
|
| jongamefan |
Posted - 08/26/2010 : 10:35:38
quote:
Originally posted by coachdan06
quote:
Originally posted by Hurricane
My opinion and many will disagree. If a kid can play he can play, if he is good teams will want him even if he never played with a travel team before. Pitchers probably save their arms sticking to rec ball. My honest opinion is if you play rec ball until 12 and are pretty good, you will make a travel team at 13. Maybe not the best one around but there are so many you will make one. If you are athletic strong arm and can run you will catch up pretty fast when the testosterone kicks in. I think Travel Baseball before 12 is probably a waste of time and money. I would be willing to bet any kid that makes it to Division I College or Minor League baseball could have played rec until 12 and still would have gotten just as far.
hurricane :i can not agree more with all you say
our observations : travel before 11 maybe 12 is very very much about dad ball and buddy ball so are the park "all star teams"
smart famlies with talented sons leave and often go to high accomplishments while the parks teams within a year or so are non competitive if not completely disbanded.
12 year old ball is where the earlier favored kids are quitting because they are being out cleerly classed by other kids and are old enough now to not like it
my direction with all this is to say wait until 12 better 13 when all the other nonsense is largely eliminated youll have alot more fun tooo
Heres the thing about travel ball too at 12u many many are Dads kids being spotlighted even though their size (too big or too small) is beginning to work against them bvecuase the big field is next
Why fight those aggravations and politics for no gain wait until they are washed out and the less talented non dad players up and quit too , then you enter a field of competition and no time wasted ! |
| bigcatsdad |
Posted - 08/25/2010 : 18:37:33
Honestly, it is 12 or 13 as several have stated. Hopefully each player will build upon each year and peak at 17-18 when it really matters. Before 12, you're probably wasting money with lessons that you as a parent can teach by watching others and with enough repetitions. |
| bballman |
Posted - 08/25/2010 : 14:24:32
quote:
Originally posted by Alter-Ego
You don't want the first time a player gets challenged to be when they are trying to make the HS team.
Alter, I agree with this statement 100%. However, my opinion (and this is all opinion) is that you don't have to play travel ball from 9 years old to accomplish this. If you play when you are 13 or 14 and even at 12, you should be fine if your talent level is there. I hear what everyone is saying about rec being watered down, and that is probably much more true than it was 7-8 years ago when my son played, but from birth to 12 or 13, baseball should just be about learning the skills and having FUN!!. If the kids enjoy it, they will continue to play. Not saying you can't have fun playing travel at the younger ages, but I think you can still have fun playing rec for a lot less money than it costs to play travel.
And Hurricane is right. It will save a lot of wear on the arm not playing year round. My son has always pitched, but when he played rec, he always had the summers off from baseball. Played in the spring and fall, but that is a far cry from startting in early March and essentially playing through end of October or into November.
Enjoy it while you can, time flies by awfully quick. I can still remember my little boy at 7 and 8 years old playing baseball. He is now a junior in HS and I really don't know where the years have gone. Taking him to showcase for a D1 college coach tonight. Very exciting in a way, very sad in another way. Only 2 years of HS left and who knows what lays beyond that. I cherish every moment I spent with him over the years. |
| Alter-Ego |
Posted - 08/25/2010 : 13:41:31
I truly believe it is most important for a kid to play where they are challenged, against competition that makes them better. For many kids, that is league ball or AAA and below travel ball. (I personally feel that kids can go either way on this option and still work out fine.)
If a player dominates in pitching (or hitting) on a league ball team, they will never be challenged to progress to their full potential. You don't want the first time a player gets challenged to be when they are trying to make the HS team.
Overall, if a kid is succeeding and failing pretty evenly in league ball, I am not sure there is a big reason to move them to travel before 13U, unless they just want to play with a bunch of their friends each year (which leagues don't typically let you do). If league play does not provide the level of coaching development you think your kid needs, get him some lessons before giving up and going to travel assuming they will get it there. That is not always a guarantee either.
The hardest part, though, is to be honest with yourself as to where you feel your kid needs to be. The question is, many times, not whether they CAN compete somewhere else, it is whether the other situation provides the best overall opportunity for their development and enjoyment. |
| Top Gun |
Posted - 08/25/2010 : 09:23:13
My only recommendation relative to getting into travel ball by at least 11U is preparation and exposure to other teams for 12U. This is the Cooperstown year, and unless you plan on moving down to Columbus or Warner Robbins to play Little League, it's an experience I hope every kid that loves baseball will have a chance to be a part of. If you start playing travel ball at 12U, it will be more difficult, but not impossible, to find a good Cooperstown-bound team. Up through 14U, it is about providing kids a fun atmosphere with great experiences like Omaha, Disney, Panama Beach and Myrtle Beach.
It all gets pretty serious at 15U for those who are settling in on their high school and possible post high school baseball from here on out. It's just too bad that people take it so seriously up to that point and lose perspective that baseball is one activity among many that a kid can learn sportsmanship, life lessons, how to make friends, and how to have fun at something you are passionate about. |
| coachdan06 |
Posted - 08/25/2010 : 00:47:18
quote:
Originally posted by Hurricane
My opinion and many will disagree. If a kid can play he can play, if he is good teams will want him even if he never played with a travel team before. Pitchers probably save their arms sticking to rec ball. My honest opinion is if you play rec ball until 12 and are pretty good, you will make a travel team at 13. Maybe not the best one around but there are so many you will make one. If you are athletic strong arm and can run you will catch up pretty fast when the testosterone kicks in. I think Travel Baseball before 12 is probably a waste of time and money. I would be willing to bet any kid that makes it to Division I College or Minor League baseball could have played rec until 12 and still would have gotten just as far.
hurricane :i can not agree more with all you say
our observations : travel before 11 maybe 12 is very very much about dad ball and buddy ball so are the park "all star teams"
smart famlies with talented sons leave and often go to high accomplishments while the parks teams within a year or so are non competitive if not completely disbanded.
12 year old ball is where the earlier favored kids are quitting because they are being out cleerly classed by other kids and are old enough now to not like it
my direction with all this is to say wait until 12 better 13 when all the other nonsense is largely eliminated youll have alot more fun tooo |
