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goyard
217 Posts |
 Posted - 10/11/2009 : 22:40:54
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| OK...be interested in hearing from you on the foundation of playing the great game of baseball as a "priviledge" to a player If grades are not up to par or other negative aspects...how have you used integrated baseball as a "priviledge" or "not"? |
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Shut Out
512 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2009 : 09:16:17
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| Absolute priviledge in our house. Bad grades no play |
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touchemall
145 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2009 : 13:14:52
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| Works in our house as well. I think you will find moreover that those kids who learn at the early ages that good grades are tied to any positive reward such as baseball will do better. No proven theory just an opinion. Baseball taught correctly teaches the kids discipline (sp?) that carries over to all aspects. But it all comes down to enforcing the rules at home and sticking to it either by helping with homework or getting them the help they need. They may let a team down by not being able to play and not like you at the time but will thank you later in life. Once baseball is over and the knees or belly give out (ha ha) they need to be ready for the real world. |
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billbclk
164 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2009 : 16:26:56
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I sat a player this weekend for a tournament game after an off the field issues. Nothing major just trying to drive home the point that you have to take care of business off the field first. I love these little "life lesson" episodes because you can really change a kids behavior.
I see it more than just a grade thing. Kids have to respect authority and the processes that are put in place by authority figures.
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lottapop
257 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2009 : 17:31:49
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| I don't use the grades card. Baseball is a team sport, therefore he has a responsibility to his team mates to be there. |
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Mike Corbin
523 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2009 : 20:45:25
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Fortunatly, I have not had to have that discussion with anyone on our current team. However here are what I believe take precedent over baseball:
1. Religion
2. Family
3. School
In that order! Those are all items that I believe take priority over baseball.
The kids do need to understand how important grades are and that good grades will probably do more to get you a scholarship down the road than baseball anyway! The very FIRST question, with out fail, by all of the college coaches that talked to our older team over the last couple of years was "how are your grades" or "what are your test scores"! |
Edited by - Mike Corbin on 10/12/2009 22:06:22 |
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touchemall
145 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 07:54:25
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| Lottapop - yes it is a team sport but it does not come before school. I will never speak for another families way of doing things but in our house it is called extra-curricular activities for one reason - it is extra. What works in one family does not work in another. It is all about motivating your kids to do their best at everything and if something is a distraction then it needs to be dealt with by either getting them the help they need or letting go of it until the grades come up. I think more parents are faster to pay for a batting lesson than they are to pay for a math lesson. |
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goyard
217 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 09:12:43
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quote:
Originally posted by touchemall
Lottapop - I think more parents are faster to pay for a batting lesson than they are to pay for a math lesson.
Well said touch! I most likely have been guilty of such but it's never too late to change our ways
Be interested in hearing coaches perspective toward a parent asking that the coach bench his kid for a game or period of time?
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wildcats9596
110 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 09:56:23
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quote:
Originally posted by goyard
Be interested in hearing coaches perspective toward a parent asking that the coach bench his kid for a game or period of time?
I would have absolutely done that if a parent had asked.
If it was to study, I might suggest that they not bring him to the game(s) so that he could get caught up. If it was some other disciplinary issue, I would suggest that they bring him to the game so that he could sit in the dugout, in uniform, and understand a) how he is affecting the team and b) what he is missing.
If the grades weren't there, neither of our boys would be playing sports. |
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billbclk
164 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 11:48:09
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I don't know Lottapop so I can't speak for him but I think the point he was making was more preemptive than punishment. I had a talk last Wed. with my guys about Accountability and doing the right things up front that will allow you to be on the field. Your team mates expect you to be on the field and it’s your responsibility to take care of business off the field to be able handle your responsibility on the field.
{SOAPBOX ALERT}
I am more concerned about behavior than bad grades. Bad behavior can happen in an instance and due to poor character and judgment. Bad grades occur over time as a result of poor study habits and lack of effort and focus. Poor focus and effort is easier to spot. We don’t use the grades because they are suppose to get good grades to be successful in life not play baseball.
There are many administrators (especially in college) that don’t want athletics in school; they are looking for ways to bench you. It’s a double standard but you have to be squeaky clean and manage you time well to play sports in school. Two things that will help you as you move on.
Lottapop if I am wrong please correct.
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goyard
217 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 12:42:08
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Isn't the "NO PASS NO PLAY" policy endorsed in High School also? Odd, but unless I am mistaken ... I have crossed paths with a few individuals that are well, let's just say, suffering in a few courses but yet still being allowed to play their sport. This would be in the Cobb Cty district. Could it be that their grades dipped into that category of No Pass No PLay but they are given a timeline to bring them back up?
PS: I hope the players are reading on this post as well! |
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10 BB
264 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 13:33:03
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I to belive baseball is a team sport and we made the jump to participate with a travel team that involves alot of people and alot of money and our responsibility is to the team.
With that said look at it in this way. My son is an average to below average student but he is an above avarage to gifted baseball player. If I take away baseball I've just taken away the one thing he is good at. I for one do not and will not look at baseball as extra curricular, I look at it as maybe a future. Some kids are great students, some great atheletes, some are not good at either but thats what makes the world go round and I believe in capitalizing on a childs good points. We do what we can with his schooling, like tuttors and had him put in classes with fewer students. He understands how much I love him and and I have always believed you get futher with honey than vinegar. When you take things away you build up resentment and a rebelious attitude |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 13:43:37
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quote:
Originally posted by goyard
Isn't the "NO PASS NO PLAY" policy endorsed in High School also? Odd, but unless I am mistaken ... I have crossed paths with a few individuals that are well, let's just say, suffering in a few courses but yet still being allowed to play their sport. This would be in the Cobb Cty district. Could it be that their grades dipped into that category of No Pass No PLay but they are given a timeline to bring them back up?
PS: I hope the players are reading on this post as well!
I'm not sure what our school's policy is, but it's probably more lax than ours, that is, we will have them off the team long before the are officially academically ineligible.
I agree on the point about behavior being more, or at least equally, important. |
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buzzworthy
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 16:23:23
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Goyard, it's our jobs as parents to prepare our children how to be productive members of society. If we don't teach them the hard lessons now, they'll have to learn them on their own later when it counts a whole lot more. And if that happens, we haven't been very good parents at all, have we? So, in my not-so-humble opinion, YES, you should absolutely use baseball as an incentive to get good grades. OK...coming off my soapbox now!! |
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AA17Dad
211 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 19:51:05
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We make our kids perform well in school.........Period. It has nothing to do with baseball in our house.
We will not punish our team if our kid gets a bad grade. As others have stated it is a team sport with alot of other families involved.
Both of my kids are A,B students. Neither are geniuses but both are good kids and get good grades because we take parenting seriously. ( no I am not saying that if your kids is struggling that you are a bad parent )
I'd hate to think that I had to leverage baseball with my kid to keep his grades up.
In my opinion " if you don't get good grades you can't play baseball " is pretty weak parenting.
That said, if I were doing everything I could as a parent and my kid was struggleing with school we would not be playing year around travel ball.
Now if you REALLY want to get their attention...take their PS3 / XBOX or maybe their cell phone away........ |
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lottapop
257 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2009 : 21:06:07
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| Bill....you are correct. Both of my sons understand if they bring home a "B" on their report cards what happens. LOL I just will not punish his team or coaches for his and mine mistakes. It works for me....both of my boys finish in the top 4 of their classes every year with all "A's". They understand my concept and it works for us. Now...if I could only teach them how to play ball. :) |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 07:48:28
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quote:
Originally posted by 10 BB
I to belive baseball is a team sport and we made the jump to participate with a travel team that involves alot of people and alot of money and our responsibility is to the team.
With that said look at it in this way. My son is an average to below average student but he is an above avarage to gifted baseball player. If I take away baseball I've just taken away the one thing he is good at. I for one do not and will not look at baseball as extra curricular, I look at it as maybe a future. Some kids are great students, some great atheletes, some are not good at either but thats what makes the world go round and I believe in capitalizing on a childs good points. We do what we can with his schooling, like tuttors and had him put in classes with fewer students. He understands how much I love him and and I have always believed you get futher with honey than vinegar. When you take things away you build up resentment and a rebelious attitude
I agree with 10BB. I will not use baseball as a tool against my son. When I was in HS, my dad told me I could not play football after missing his grade goals in one class. Before football season came around, he told me I could play if I wanted, but I was stubborn and would not do it - just to spite him. I never played football again. I would not want that to happen with my son. It is possible this could happen with my son. Maybe for some it wouldn't happen, but I would not want to be the cause of this.
Now, he has been banned from x-box, his phone, his ipod and grounded. We have also employed tutors and having him go into school early for help sessions. I've got no problem with that. I personally won't use baseball as a stick. |
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Shut Out
512 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 08:48:27
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quote:
Originally posted by 10 BB
I to belive baseball is a team sport and we made the jump to participate with a travel team that involves alot of people and alot of money and our responsibility is to the team.
With that said look at it in this way. My son is an average to below average student but he is an above avarage to gifted baseball player. If I take away baseball I've just taken away the one thing he is good at. I for one do not and will not look at baseball as extra curricular, I look at it as maybe a future. Some kids are great students, some great atheletes, some are not good at either but thats what makes the world go round and I believe in capitalizing on a childs good points. We do what we can with his schooling, like tuttors and had him put in classes with fewer students. He understands how much I love him and and I have always believed you get futher with honey than vinegar. When you take things away you build up resentment and a rebelious attitude
10BB i understand what you are saying to a point. But believe me whether your son is the next Jeter or A-Rod he is only 1 major injury away from doing a job that his education has prepared him for. I do realize not every child is equal in the class room and shouldn't be held to the same standards. However i do believe you know what would be considered your childs best work in the class room when he gives full effort. Even if he can't make A's or B's he should always give full effort to do his best work. With that said your childs education at 11U is far more important than how he performs on the field at this age so maybe if he knew that giving 100% in the classroom no matter the grade he achieves was expected to play ball you might be suprised at how much better he does in the class room. I pray for you and all our kids that their dreams of playing ball at the highest level come true but really even if they are gifted now his chance of making it is still like being struck by lightning twice. |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 09:42:11
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I just think every parent and every kid is different. There is no right or wrong, only what we think is best for our kids. Like I said, there are plenty of options to motivate our kids to do well in school. Baseball/sports is an option in some's minds and not an option in other's.
Now, on the other hand, if baseball as an activity is scheduled and there is a school project or test or something going on that needs to be done on the same night as practice or even a game, school comes first and the kid should miss for that in my mind. I just don't believe it should be used as a punishment.
BTW, it is not just because anyone believes that their son is so good they will be a pro one day. I think there are life lessons to be learned via sports. To be able to do well in life, you will always have multiple obligations that will need to be dealt with. To be involved in sports and school, a student must learn to prioritize and handle both. If you take one away, there are lessons that will not be learned. As an adult, I must juggle the responsibilities of work, wife, kids, bills, etc. I can't just drop one because I am struggling with another. This lesson can start to be learned at an early age. |
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goyard
217 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 09:52:25
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I knew there would be varying opinions on this subject. Like most of you, i have a great son who I am Very Proud of. He's not perfect in school, nor was his father. He makes good grades then faulters at times. This happens to be one of those times. School curriculum and load came easy at an early age so study habits got highly dilluted and now is catching up. In eighth grade he is finding himself having to rethink his HABITS and EFFORTS and manage time in a much more wise way - not easy for him now.
Interesting point .... In speaking with several counselors, I have been told that taking away an organized sport like baseball should be absolute LAST RESORT. Of course I was taken back and asked why. Their reasoning (be it right or wrong) is that baseball, football or another organized sport mirrors the good things we are trying to instill. Things such as structure, focus, sportsmanship, good behavior, respect, execution and yes, making the grade are all said to be in effect with the attachment of the sport.
Now, my wife and I can agree to disagree on this one because my son seems numb to giving up many things but the mere thought of giving up baseball sends him into a panic. I am aslo a big believer now that if I threaten to take it away, I better execute and follow with action. So, as a recent result and a suffering grade or two my son has been missing a whole lot of his "other" love in hunting and will now miss Opening Day of rifle. It's as tuff on me as it is him and maybe worse as they are memories we can never get back. Again, great kid and we are very fortunate that he is who he is - this grade thing i think is some PAYBACK for my days in school
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AA17Dad
211 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 10:59:42
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quote:
Originally posted by goyard
I knew there would be varying opinions on this subject. Like most of you, i have a great son who I am Very Proud of. He's not perfect in school, nor was his father. He makes good grades then faulters at times. This happens to be one of those times. School curriculum and load came easy at an early age so study habits got highly dilluted and now is catching up. In eighth grade he is finding himself having to rethink his HABITS and EFFORTS and manage time in a much more wise way - not easy for him now.
Interesting point .... In speaking with several counselors, I have been told that taking away an organized sport like baseball should be absolute LAST RESORT. Of course I was taken back and asked why. Their reasoning (be it right or wrong) is that baseball, football or another organized sport mirrors the good things we are trying to instill. Things such as structure, focus, sportsmanship, good behavior, respect, execution and yes, making the grade are all said to be in effect with the attachment of the sport.
Now, my wife and I can agree to disagree on this one because my son seems numb to giving up many things but the mere thought of giving up baseball sends him into a panic. I am aslo a big believer now that if I threaten to take it away, I better execute and follow with action. So, as a recent result and a suffering grade or two my son has been missing a whole lot of his "other" love in hunting and will now miss Opening Day of rifle. It's as tuff on me as it is him and maybe worse as they are memories we can never get back. Again, great kid and we are very fortunate that he is who he is - this grade thing i think is some PAYBACK for my days in school
Sounds like you got a handle on it and some good feedback from the counselors.
OPENING DAY.......dangit boy.....that's got a hurt........ |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 13:34:10
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quote:
Originally posted by bballman
I just don't believe it should be used as a punishment.
As an adult, I must juggle the responsibilities of work, wife, kids, bills, etc. I can't just drop one because I am struggling with another. This lesson can start to be learned at an early age.
It's not a punishment, it's the price of admission whether it be baseball, orchestra, chess club, whatever. Their first, by a long shot, responsibility is getting their education. Everything else is gravy.
As far as juggling responsibilities, your bills/job/marriage aren't comparable to his playing sports. A better comparison is golf. If you have a project due at work and a tee time, and they conflict, the tee time goes. Same thing with baseball for him. |
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Shut Out
512 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 15:36:12
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quote:
Originally posted by AllStar
quote:
Originally posted by bballman
I just don't believe it should be used as a punishment.
As an adult, I must juggle the responsibilities of work, wife, kids, bills, etc. I can't just drop one because I am struggling with another. This lesson can start to be learned at an early age.
It's not a punishment, it's the price of admission whether it be baseball, orchestra, chess club, whatever. Their first, by a long shot, responsibility is getting their education. Everything else is gravy.
As far as juggling responsibilities, your bills/job/marriage aren't comparable to his playing sports. A better comparison is golf. If you have a project due at work and a tee time, and they conflict, the tee time goes. Same thing with baseball for him.
Well said Allstar! |
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bballman
1432 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2009 : 16:36:40
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AllStar, I already said if a school project is due, it would take priority over baseball. And, in my mind, him playing baseball is different than me playing golf. For one thing, golf is individual, baseball is a team.
Here is what I said -
quote:
Originally posted by bballman
Now, on the other hand, if baseball as an activity is scheduled and there is a school project or test or something going on that needs to be done on the same night as practice or even a game, school comes first and the kid should miss for that in my mind. I just don't believe it should be used as a punishment.
If you tell someone, "If you don't get your grades to a certain level, you will not play baseball" - that is a punishment. If you say "If you don't get your grades to a certain level, you will not play X-box" - that is also a punishment. No difference. I just don't want to use baseball as a punishment.
Not criticizing you or anyone else. If it works for you, do it. Just don't say it is not being used as a punishment or consequence. You are kidding yourself. |
Edited by - bballman on 10/14/2009 19:12:35 |
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Alter-Ego
802 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2009 : 09:17:33
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I won't use the "If you get a bad grade, you are not playing this weekend." punishment.
I side with bballman as baseball being a team sport, you have committments to others. I will, however, take away things like video game play, cell phone, going outside to play after school, extra curricular activities, etc. The only way I would bring baseball into it is if my child was struggling getting started each school year, I might say "Let's reduce the amount you play this fall to allow for you to concentrate more on your studies and get some good habits started this school year. That way by the time spring comes you have a good routine down."
I agree that their grades come first, but I can't see, personally, using baseball in the punishment equation. |
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goyard
217 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2009 : 09:37:35
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Back in my young school days ....a hickory limb or leather belt served as pretty good Re-Directors!!! haha Boy have things changed |
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Baseball Priviledge
