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touchemall
145 Posts |
 Posted - 08/05/2009 : 23:10:08
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| The Dizzy Dean season just wrapped up and word is spreading that one of the teams that did very well (will not name - just wanting to know the rules) had an ineligible player on their team. I question if he was or was not eligible and ask your opinion. The player played the previous year (summer 2008) on a travel team but came back to his home park (no address change happened). I thought the rules stated you must sit out a year from rec ball all stars if you were not at that park the year prior. Not looking to cause trouble but wonder how anyone else interprets the vague rules of Dizzy Dean. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 09:24:08
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| Aren't there Dizzy Dean district and state coordinators that could answer your question? |
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3sondad
220 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 09:24:34
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| He is OK as long as he did not play in another Dizzy Dean park. Being part of a travel team the previous year has nothing to do to it. In fact he can be part of a Travel ball team the same year. It use to be the player could be part of a travel team but had to be off their roster by May 15th, but I believe they are even more forgiving now... But here is the catch and the reason I would not even try it, the player (AND TEAM) would become ineligible if he missed a rec. league game because he played in a travel baseball game. There are other rules that must be closely guarded against with regard to all-star rosters and travel teams, but playing the previous year on a travel team is no reason for the player to be ineligible. |
Edited by - 3sondad on 08/06/2009 10:52:46 |
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bkball
173 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 10:04:46
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| Who cares the kid is young let him play baseball.... it aint about winning and losing. |
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BREAMKING
323 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 11:02:01
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| Let them play! Let them play! Let them play!. I guess that is my bad news bears quote for the day. I am pretty sure that player was good to go. |
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bkball
173 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 11:36:00
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| I believe the rule is if you played at one park in Dizzy Dean you must sitout or get released from your park. I dont think Travel ball makes a difference. |
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ronicard
117 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 12:09:09
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No, the player isn't ineligible because he played travel ball the prior year. Dizzy Dean bases their all star eligibility purely on where the player played his recreation league games during the spring season. If the player played on a Dizzy Dean all star team the prior year for another park the previous year, he would be ineligible at the new park unless he had received a clearance waiver. These can be obtained if: a) a player moves or changes from living with 1 parent to living with another b) the park where he played the prior year signs a waiver allowing him to play with the new park.
3sondad is correct in saying that, if he missed a recreation league game to play in a travel tournament, then that player is ineligible to play Dizzy Dean all stars that year.
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 13:26:20
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quote:
Originally posted by bkball
....it aint about winning and losing....
Ha! You're not from around here, are you? :D |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 17:45:52
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Pretty easy answer (and MOST of above are true).
Dizzy Dean Common Rules:
15:05 All players age 12 & under, who change franchised Dizzy Dean Baseball, Inc. organizations without changing their legal residence, if the original organization offers their age group, will be ineligible for tournament play for one year.
The rule above mentions that, even in the case of a change of legal residence, the National State Executive Board of the state in which you reside must approve. It doesn't make mention that the former park may give a waiver. That used to be the case, but I believe that those waivers are no longer allowed (the rulebook used to make this point, but it no longer exists in the rulebook).
As to 3sondad's comment above, Nothing stipulates that missing a Rec game makes a player ineligible. Playing in multiple tournaments does (see rules below). The only stipulation about playing Rec states that the Rec league must play at least a 12 game schedule.
11:08 A player or team cannot participate in two tournaments at the same time (ie Dizzy Dean, Pony, AABC, etc...)
11:09 A player cannot participate in another tournament afer teh Dizzy Dean District, State, or World Series Tournament starts. (Boynton Bandits were stripped of their State Title in 2007 and had to forfeit a DDWS pool game as well as remove the ineligible player for remainder of WS for violation of this rule)
The above two rules are designed more to protect players (pitchers) from injury due to over use.
In touchemall's post above, the kid is completely eligible per Dizzy Dean's rules. |
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3sondad
220 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 21:36:59
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quote:
Originally posted by in_the_know
Pretty easy answer (and MOST of above are true).
..
As to 3sondad's comment above, Nothing stipulates that missing a Rec game makes a player ineligible. Playing in multiple tournaments does (see rules below). The only stipulation about playing Rec states that the Rec league must play at least a 12 game schedule.
This is where I picked up on that one...
11:11 Any player who misses any scheduled league game to play on a pick-up or tournament team before league play ends will not be eligible for all-star play.
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touchemall
145 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 21:40:24
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| Thanks everyone. What is the reason for the rule then of not allowing players to switch parks and play the next year in all-stars unless you meet the criteria? To me a travel ball player that decides to come back to a dizzy dean program is basically changing parks. Just because it was not a dizzy dean program should not matter. I have seen kids that should be on all-stars that could not be picked because they switched parks and unknowingly disqualified themselves from being on the team. And then they see a kid who was not at the park the year before because he played on a travel team be allowed to play - sounds to me like a double standard. |
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ronicard
117 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 22:36:27
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in_the_know,
Thanks for the clarification. I used to be a league director in a Dizzy Dean park and we picked up 2 players (different age groups...one of them actually wound up on my team is why I know it) that had played in another park the previous year. At that time, we were able to get the other park's permission and they were allowed to play. However, this was 4 years ago, so they may very well have closed out that option.
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rjrousseau1
81 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 08:45:56
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| I always wondered why Dizzy Dean spent the money to print rule books because they rarely enforced the rules. We had a kid leave our park after playing Dizzy Dean allstars, go to a nearby park the next year without changing addresses, and played on a Dizzy Dean World Series championship team and he was one of the stars. It was pointed out to Dizzy Dean before the districts even started that the kid was not eligible per their rules but they let him keep playing and the team kept winning. Our park never allowed anyone who came from another Dizzy Dean park to play allstars their first year at our park... because that was the rule. And we left some pretty good players off allstar rosters because of that rule. I am all for letting the kids play, and since Dizzy Dean doesn't enforce these kind of rules they should just get rid of them. |
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12uCoach
357 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 08:50:45
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I find rule 11:08 and 11:09 amusing and added since 1998. I took the Perry Parham Dizzy Dean 9U team and we played AAU and USSSA State Tournaments while they competed as the Dizzy Dean team in district and state. Played 20 games in 30 days and had a blast.
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 10:02:41
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3son - I stand corrected, 11:11 is correct.
So unless it was proven that the player in the original post missed a rec league game to play a pickup or tournament game, he would still be eligible.
touchemall - the reason is to prevent rec all-star teams from doing what many travel teams do; actively recruit from other parks to beef up their team. The rule discourages families from moving between parks for the mere purpose of trying to concentrate talent. |
Edited by - in_the_know on 08/07/2009 10:03:33 |
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touchemall
145 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 10:11:44
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| Who is to say a coach cannot recruit a player from travel to play on a DD team? Looks like a loophole. The rule should read that anyone who did not play in a DD sanctioned park the previous year should not be allowed to play all-stars the following year. |
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Phattso
143 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 10:25:38
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quote:
Originally posted by rjrousseau1
I always wondered why Dizzy Dean spent the money to print rule books because they rarely enforced the rules. We had a kid leave our park after playing Dizzy Dean allstars, go to a nearby park the next year without changing addresses, and played on a Dizzy Dean World Series championship team and he was one of the stars. It was pointed out to Dizzy Dean before the districts even started that the kid was not eligible per their rules but they let him keep playing and the team kept winning. Our park never allowed anyone who came from another Dizzy Dean park to play allstars their first year at our park... because that was the rule. And we left some pretty good players off allstar rosters because of that rule. I am all for letting the kids play, and since Dizzy Dean doesn't enforce these kind of rules they should just get rid of them.
I 1000% agree with this. This along with the sub issues is exactly why my group will not be playing Dizzy Dean anymore. During our World Series we had eligibility questions about a kid on another team and instead of enforcing rules, they swept everything under the rug. Another team indeed had an ineligible player on their roster. The kid played all stars at another park the year before, but was now on another all star team and did NOT move or was NOT released. This team was protested 4 times throughout the series, but every protest was denied. As a matter of fact, by the end of the series this team supposedly lost their roster so no one could view it anymore. Turns out that a big wig for Dizzy Dean had a grandson on the team with the ineligible kid. So, no way they were disqualifying that team. Dizzy Dean is a joke... It's supposed to be about the kids yet they have these crappy sub rules and also are willing to keep a coach from coaching because he has pockets on his shorts.
And I agree, let the kids play. But, rules are in place for a reason and if someone breaks them they need to pay the consequences.
So long Dizzy Dean... Won't miss u a bit!!!! |
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3sondad
220 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 12:03:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Phattso
[quote]Originally posted by rjrousseau1
So long Dizzy Dean... Won't miss u a bit!!!!
You got your park to change affiliations or are you leaving for greener pastures?
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Phattso
143 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2009 : 16:59:25
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quote:
Originally posted by 3sondad
quote:
Originally posted by Phattso
[quote]Originally posted by rjrousseau1
So long Dizzy Dean... Won't miss u a bit!!!!
You got your park to change affiliations or are you leaving for greener pastures?
Greener Pastures... East Cobb |
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Eligibility question
