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743
215 Posts |
 Posted - 05/12/2016 : 12:20:43
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Saw a post about Dominican Baseball and wanted to get Punishers thoughts on the baseball swing or how you guys teach it?
Always looking for new information and think the DR guys have some of the best swings out there.
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Renegade44
211 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2016 : 14:09:31
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Like See fastball, hit fastball approach?
Or the more advanced approach as is being required in sons high school? Take fastball strike one, lay off the curve on outside corner, please note you are now down 0-2. Get in your 2 strike stance (what the heck is that?). Choke up, widen your stance to a no step point, and put the ball on the ground.
Please God send us a DR coach and attitude. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2016 : 14:53:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Renegade44
Like See fastball, hit fastball approach?
Or the more advanced approach as is being required in sons high school? Take fastball strike one, lay off the curve on outside corner, please note you are now down 0-2. Get in your 2 strike stance (what the heck is that?). Choke up, widen your stance to a no step point, and put the ball on the ground.
Please God send us a DR coach and attitude.
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!! Maybe you can hope the other teams coach ALSO has his kid playing SS? LOL! |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 06:05:56
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quote:
Originally posted by 743
Saw a post about Dominican Baseball and wanted to get Punishers thoughts on the baseball swing or how you guys teach it?
Always looking for new information and think the DR guys have some of the best swings out there.
Just saw this. Are you asking in general or in count situation? Generally-For us it is all about swing path and finish. Our flag drill helps with this. Of course this is assuming that the batters stance and load are already established. Amazing how the simple things are the best training aids rather than the fancy more expensive gadgets that are out there today.
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Edited by - Punishers on 05/13/2016 09:00:55 |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 07:28:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Renegade44
Like See fastball, hit fastball approach?
Or the more advanced approach as is being required in sons high school? Take fastball strike one, lay off the curve on outside corner, please note you are now down 0-2. Get in your 2 strike stance (what the heck is that?). Choke up, widen your stance to a no step point, and put the ball on the ground.
Please God send us a DR coach and attitude.
Never heard of this "2 strike stance", maybe someone can explain this.
Is this am issue of the batter not making contact with the ball or are they hitting a lot of ground ball infield dribblers? |
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BREAMKING
323 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 10:12:01
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| long time ago we did two strike mode coach had us point feet towards second base and just make contact to hit singles. He made us do it because we were having a lot of strike outs. by the way it worked we won state championship that year. We got so good at it as a team we were deadly on hit and runs. |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 11:04:10
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quote:
Originally posted by BREAMKING
long time ago we did two strike mode coach had us point feet towards second base and just make contact to hit singles. He made us do it because we were having a lot of strike outs. by the way it worked we won state championship that year. We got so good at it as a team we were deadly on hit and runs.
Interesting. I would think it would lead to more infield outs. Sounds like the other teams didn't adjust. Weak hitting team means moving the fielding players in a few feet. |
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BREAMKING
323 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 16:49:10
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| Might would be different now with bbcor bats for sure I think. |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 17:43:34
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quote:
Originally posted by BREAMKING
Might would be different now with bbcor bats for sure I think.
Ahhhhhh. The good old wooden days. I miss them. |
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bfriendly
376 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2016 : 05:50:57
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We talking hitting in general, or two strike approach
With two strikes, the only thing I have taught my son is to go oppo with the fast ball so he can stay back on a change up.......with a pitcher throwing a bunch of change ups, then we may try to go oppo the entire AB. Always trying to hit a dinger though, wether its to the oppo field or not.
I would like some elaboration on this "Flag Drill" Mr Punisher..........please. It may be just what the OP was asking for in the first place |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2016 : 22:27:08
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quote:
Originally posted by bfriendly
We talking hitting in general, or two strike approach
With two strikes, the only thing I have taught my son is to go oppo with the fast ball so he can stay back on a change up.......with a pitcher throwing a bunch of change ups, then we may try to go oppo the entire AB. Always trying to hit a dinger though, wether its to the oppo field or not.
I would like some elaboration on this "Flag Drill" Mr Punisher..........please. It may be just what the OP was asking for in the first place
Can't expose all my training methods here.
It was something that I learned from my high school coach when I had problems with my bat staying in the hitting zone enough. Have no idea where he got it from, but he did play in the MLB. Helps with those who have more fast-twitch muscles and too quick for their own good. I went from fowl tips to hitting singles and doubles. |
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sebaseball
101 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 10:25:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by bfriendly
We talking hitting in general, or two strike approach
With two strikes, the only thing I have taught my son is to go oppo with the fast ball so he can stay back on a change up.......with a pitcher throwing a bunch of change ups, then we may try to go oppo the entire AB. Always trying to hit a dinger though, wether its to the oppo field or not.
I would like some elaboration on this "Flag Drill" Mr Punisher..........please. It may be just what the OP was asking for in the first place
Can't expose all my training methods here.
It was something that I learned from my high school coach when I had problems with my bat staying in the hitting zone enough. Have no idea where he got it from, but he did play in the MLB. Helps with those who have more fast-twitch muscles and too quick for their own good. I went from fowl tips to hitting singles and doubles.
I'm sorry, but that is the most absolute lame excuse I've ever heard. Like you're going to give away the hitting secret that's gonna make you millions. Give me a freakin' break. Sounds like to me you have them swing a small flag or attach a flag to the barrel of the bat so that they can both hear and see the flag waving as they get on plane and extend through the hitting zone before releasing into the follow through. Basically a way to help them see/feel/understand how to be short to and long through. |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 15:24:51
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| I was just talking the linear vs Rotational, Hands to the ball or Rotate, back foot spin vs slide forward or come off the ground, Forward Shoulder and head movement before foot plant vs no forward head movement at all, type stuff. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 08:26:10
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| Each kids body moves in its own way, each swing is different based on what will give the kid more power, and the movement changes as they grow. The one universal truth is the less moving parts the better. If a kid has to go through a series of ten small movements to get his power swing he's not going to be able to keep up when the game is faster. |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 11:55:16
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quote:
Originally posted by sebaseball
quote:
Originally posted by Punishers
quote:
Originally posted by bfriendly
We talking hitting in general, or two strike approach
With two strikes, the only thing I have taught my son is to go oppo with the fast ball so he can stay back on a change up.......with a pitcher throwing a bunch of change ups, then we may try to go oppo the entire AB. Always trying to hit a dinger though, wether its to the oppo field or not.
I would like some elaboration on this "Flag Drill" Mr Punisher..........please. It may be just what the OP was asking for in the first place
Can't expose all my training methods here.
It was something that I learned from my high school coach when I had problems with my bat staying in the hitting zone enough. Have no idea where he got it from, but he did play in the MLB. Helps with those who have more fast-twitch muscles and too quick for their own good. I went from fowl tips to hitting singles and doubles.
I'm sorry, but that is the most absolute lame excuse I've ever heard. Like you're going to give away the hitting secret that's gonna make you millions. Give me a freakin' break. Sounds like to me you have them swing a small flag or attach a flag to the barrel of the bat so that they can both hear and see the flag waving as they get on plane and extend through the hitting zone before releasing into the follow through. Basically a way to help them see/feel/understand how to be short to and long through.
Don't get your panties in a wad. Not too many trainers are going to expose their training methods unless they are already public domain. The master doesn't teach the students everything.
Looks like you have enough baseball intelligence to either figure it out or get close to it. Besides if I told you everything, what will you learn? |
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 12:06:10
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quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
Each kids body moves in its own way, each swing is different based on what will give the kid more power, and the movement changes as they grow. The one universal truth is the less moving parts the better. If a kid has to go through a series of ten small movements to get his power swing he's not going to be able to keep up when the game is faster.
Agreed. Sounds like a mom that has been around the game for a while. One small change in mechanics can make or break a hitter. I prefer to see more hip shoulder separation to produce power. Generally someone with a low COG (center of Gravity) will produce less rotational torque than someone with a higher COG.
Take a close look at most good hitters. Watch their waist closely. Their hips move before their hands. Not at the same time. Don't get distracted by the leg kicks. |
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ABC_Baseball
90 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 14:23:40
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Well, I will add something that nobody has talked about. Funny how one of the guys at our academy asked my son's team and parents what was the most important component of hitting. His answer and I happen to agree is "pitch selection." The one thing that frustrates me the most is when I see kids "waste" strikes. If you don't know the strike zone and can't lay off the pitch in your eyes, good luck.
I like hitters that make pitchers work and don't chase bad pitches. Sure breaking balls and changes-ups may throw you off, but lets not help the pitcher do his job.
With regards to just hitting the ball, line it up and put it in play. I don't need you to try and kill it. I don't need to see a stance change with two strikes. I don't really care if you go opposite field or pull the ball, just put it in play and get on. I do think having a short and compact swing will lead to a higher level of good contact and a better average. |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 15:31:53
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I can agree with everything that was said, although can you give me an examples of a major leaguers when you talked about "Generally someone with a low COG (center of Gravity) will produce less rotational torque than someone with a higher COG."
Would Albert Pujols be considered someone with a low COG? and Griffey Jr High COG?
Just learning here and what causes the low vs high COG, genetics or stance and stride or something I am not thinking about? Seems to me 90% of MLB hitters get lower as they stride, head moves down and forward.
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sebaseball
101 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 18:47:15
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quote:
Originally posted by 743
I can agree with everything that was said, although can you give me an examples of a major leaguers when you talked about "Generally someone with a low COG (center of Gravity) will produce less rotational torque than someone with a higher COG."
Would Albert Pujols be considered someone with a low COG? and Griffey Jr High COG?
Just learning here and what causes the low vs high COG, genetics or stance and stride or something I am not thinking about? Seems to me 90% of MLB hitters get lower as they stride, head moves down and forward.
I believe he's talking about the hitters head and torso being in the center of his stance once his stride foot lands and his hands are in the "launch" position. You want to be pretty close to having your weight 50/50 once you take your stride and are ready to hit. The visual I give my hitters is that of a pyramid. Their feet are the base and their head is the pointy top; everything needs to be centered up and on balance.
If you reach with your stride foot & keep too much weight on your back leg at front foot strike, you're typically going to collapse on your back leg and not generate much power. If your weight is around 50/50, you are in a position to drive off your back foot & transfer your weight to hit against a firm front leg. This doesn't mean that you become a front foot hitter & end up with your weight over your front leg though. |
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 08:09:39
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quote:
Originally posted by ABC_Baseball
Well, I will add something that nobody has talked about. Funny how one of the guys at our academy asked my son's team and parents what was the most important component of hitting. His answer and I happen to agree is "pitch selection." The one thing that frustrates me the most is when I see kids "waste" strikes. If you don't know the strike zone and can't lay off the pitch in your eyes, good luck.
I like hitters that make pitchers work and don't chase bad pitches. Sure breaking balls and changes-ups may throw you off, but lets not help the pitcher do his job.
With regards to just hitting the ball, line it up and put it in play. I don't need you to try and kill it. I don't need to see a stance change with two strikes. I don't really care if you go opposite field or pull the ball, just put it in play and get on. I do think having a short and compact swing will lead to a higher level of good contact and a better average.
What I underlined and bolded is only true on two strikes. Before that you had better have a plan. Where are your runners, where is the outfield hole, has third base not stopped a ball all day long, is the outfield loosing the ball in the sun? The batter should have a plan for every at bat, and not swing at the junk the pitcher is throwing until he has two strikes and has to swing at the junk pitches.
A short compact swing has less moving parts and it will result in better contact and a better average. For those that don't understand why here is an example. 12u, I saw a boy start with his left foot back, almost like a sprinter start, bat jacked up high in the air, way beyond loading, twirling the bat in a circle. After around 60 mph he couldn't hit anything....why....because by the time he got his foot back in line with his other foot to give him a decent power base, body tilted back so he could shift his power, stopped the motion of twirling the bat, brought his hands down to where he actually needed to swing...yeah that ball was already in the catchers glove.
Less moving parts is what gets it done, it may not LOOK fancy, but you aren't there to look cool, you are there to get a hit. |
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ABC_Baseball
90 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 09:48:30
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quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
A short compact swing has less moving parts and it will result in better contact and a better average. For those that don't understand why here is an example. 12u, I saw a boy start with his left foot back, almost like a sprinter start, bat jacked up high in the air, way beyond loading, twirling the bat in a circle. After around 60 mph he couldn't hit anything....why....because by the time he got his foot back in line with his other foot to give him a decent power base, body tilted back so he could shift his power, stopped the motion of twirling the bat, brought his hands down to where he actually needed to swing...yeah that ball was already in the catchers glove.
Less moving parts is what gets it done, it may not LOOK fancy, but you aren't there to look cool, you are there to get a hit.
I may journey off topic a little here.
I get the importance with of the big power swing. The cleanup hitter is a big thing and you want / need players that are going to clear the bases. A long/big swing tends to be more of a power swing.
When looking at the majors I see so much emphasis put on one type of player. They want the player that can crush the baseball and they are excited about the long ball. Nobody seems to care about strike outs. Not too many seem to get excited about the guy with the high average, high on-base % and low number of strike outs. After all, if you can't get guys on base, you can't outscore the other team.
I fought that battle last year looking for a team for my son and I'm sure I may have to do it again in the future. You take a big kid who crushes the ball in a tryout, everybody wants him. A kid slightly above average that lines it to the gap consistently doesn't really stand out or excite people that much. Part of it may be that you don't really see his true value until you look at a larger body of work.
I told my kid while we were doing some tee work the other day, "Don't every get it in your head that you have to change as a hitter." I don't know how long he will play this game, but he has a "leadoff" mentality and leadoff type skill. He takes his walks, he makes pitchers work, he runs well, and he will do almost anything to get on base. I've seen too many kids want to kill a pitcher throwing the slow meatball or put one over the fence on a short field so badly that they end up doing more harm than good. Patience and staying within yourself is as big of a factor as anything with hitting. |
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hshuler
1074 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 10:19:11
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I teach a very simple hitting philosophy - 1)look for a mistake and don't miss it! 2) don't swing at a pitcher's pitch until you get two strikes.
Obviously, understanding situational hitting and learning the value of having productive outs at times are very important too. |
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Renegade44
211 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 10:55:15
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See fastball, hit fastball, ball go far.
Best way to hit curveball. Don't miss fastball. |
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743
215 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 12:19:53
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This... I get!!!!!!! and agree with 100% very true...
the hitters head and torso being in the center of his stance once his stride foot lands and his hands are in the "launch" position. You want to be pretty close to having your weight 50/50 once you take your stride and are ready to hit. The visual I give my hitters is that of a pyramid. Their feet are the base and their head is the pointy top; everything needs to be centered up and on balance.
If you reach with your stride foot & keep too much weight on your back leg at front foot strike, you're typically going to collapse on your back leg and not generate much power. If your weight is around 50/50, you are in a position to drive off your back foot & transfer your weight to hit against a firm front leg. This doesn't mean that you become a front foot hitter & end up with your weight over your front leg though.
I agree with ABC too you have to know what kind of hitter you are, too many times coaches do look at big giants first. With the BBCOR bats now you don't see this as much at the 14 and up though. These crazy drop 5's and drop 8'sand 10's.are ridiculous. I have seen 12 year olds with these bats, hit balls further than HS kids with BBCOR. |
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Hurricane
351 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 12:33:15
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sebaseball you or anyone else have any good drills for a kid that is out front, his weight too far forward when his front heel lands? I think it might be his stride is too short but not sure? Thanks Caine
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Punishers
688 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2016 : 12:52:18
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quote:
Originally posted by ABC_Baseball
quote:
Originally posted by CaCO3Girl
A short compact swing has less moving parts and it will result in better contact and a better average. For those that don't understand why here is an example. 12u, I saw a boy start with his left foot back, almost like a sprinter start, bat jacked up high in the air, way beyond loading, twirling the bat in a circle. After around 60 mph he couldn't hit anything....why....because by the time he got his foot back in line with his other foot to give him a decent power base, body tilted back so he could shift his power, stopped the motion of twirling the bat, brought his hands down to where he actually needed to swing...yeah that ball was already in the catchers glove.
Less moving parts is what gets it done, it may not LOOK fancy, but you aren't there to look cool, you are there to get a hit.
I may journey off topic a little here.
I get the importance with of the big power swing. The cleanup hitter is a big thing and you want / need players that are going to clear the bases. A long/big swing tends to be more of a power swing.
When looking at the majors I see so much emphasis put on one type of player. They want the player that can crush the baseball and they are excited about the long ball. Nobody seems to care about strike outs. Not too many seem to get excited about the guy with the high average, high on-base % and low number of strike outs. After all, if you can't get guys on base, you can't outscore the other team.
I fought that battle last year looking for a team for my son and I'm sure I may have to do it again in the future. You take a big kid who crushes the ball in a tryout, everybody wants him. A kid slightly above average that lines it to the gap consistently doesn't really stand out or excite people that much. Part of it may be that you don't really see his true value until you look at a larger body of work.
I told my kid while we were doing some tee work the other day, "Don't every get it in your head that you have to change as a hitter." I don't know how long he will play this game, but he has a "leadoff" mentality and leadoff type skill. He takes his walks, he makes pitchers work, he runs well, and he will do almost anything to get on base. I've seen too many kids want to kill a pitcher throwing the slow meatball or put one over the fence on a short field so badly that they end up doing more harm than good. Patience and staying within yourself is as big of a factor as anything with hitting.
I would take a line drive hitter over a crusher any day. HR hitters strike out too much and hit a lot of pop-ups which make for easy outs. Contact hitters that can find gaps are my choice in hitters. HR's are just too glorified these days.
Don't worry, have your kid keep up the good work and you keep working with him. Others will see that the crusher will strike out more than anyone on the team. His size doesn't matter. Pitchers can easily adapt to his type.
Count:
1. Inside fastball - up
2. Inside fastball - waist
3. Outside change up - down
Maybe throw in a junk pitch to see if he swings.
Easy Out. Can't do that to a contact hitter.
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Edited by - Punishers on 05/18/2016 19:23:18 |
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Lets talk hitting
