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in_the_know
985 Posts |
 Posted - 08/25/2015 : 10:43:49
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Voted on yesterday and shot down unanimously, 8-0. Unfortunate for Cobb since baseball is extremely popular in Cobb schools and because so many Cobb Schools carry between 20-30 JV players rather than cut too many 9th graders leading to a serious lack of playing time for many JV players.
Ultimately they cited funding/logistics (fields, buses, etc) & Title IX as the key hurdles. Schools would have had to look into adding another female sport for compliance. |
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LittleDawg
91 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2015 : 12:02:32
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Shame.....
MARIETTA — Cobb school board members decided against adding ninth-grade baseball to the list of available sports for Cobb students this year, citing challenges with facilities and Title IX stipulations.
During a daylong working retreat Monday, Dr. Grant Rivera, the district’s chief leadership and learning officer, said an eight-member committee was tasked in June with looking into the possibility of adding ninth-grade baseball to the district.
Cobb now offers junior varsity and varsity baseball programs. Junior varsity teams are generally reserved for sophomores, while varsity teams are for juniors and seniors. Rivera said talented players can always “play up” a level, such as a freshman playing on a varsity or junior varsity team. However, upper classmen cannot play on lower level teams.
“There were significant concerns, particularly around facilities, field space and human resources and coaches,” Rivera said. “The recommendation, unanimously 8-0, was not to recommend ninth-grade baseball.”
Cobb school board Chairman Randy Scamihorn and board member Susan Thayer expressed their support for the staff recommendation.
Scamihorn asked if other school systems in metro Atlanta had ninth-grade baseball programs. Rivera said some districts funded freshman baseball programs, some systems did not allow the programs at all and others had programs that were funded by local schools and not the county.
Marietta and Clayton do not allow ninth-grade baseball programs; Gwinnett has a ninth-grade baseball program supplemented by the district; and four metro Atlanta districts allow the programs to be locally funded but do not provide district funds, Rivera said.
“Of those four districts, Cherokee had one team of all their high schools, Fulton has three, Paulding and Douglas both allow it, but they have no teams as of the time of this report,” Rivera said.
Rivera said the committee looked into eight different themes regarding the possibility, and identified four as significant for determining whether or not to bring freshman baseball to the county.
The four themes the committee found to be critical to the success or failure of a ninth-grade baseball program in Cobb were facilities and field space, transportation and the availability of buses after school, coaches and cost per school. The other four “secondary, but relative,” themes were scheduling, administrative coverage, players and participation patterns.
“Really, what drove this recommendation were those logistical considerations that cause major problems for schools,” Rivera said.
Rivera said, as a caveat, if the school board wanted to consider adding a freshman baseball program, then it would also need to look into adding another sport specifically for ninth-grade girls because of Title IX requirements.
Enacted in 1972, Title IX is a federal law that requires equal gender opportunities at any educational institution receiving federal financial assistance.
Currently, Rivera said the district offers 20 athletic programs #8213; most of which are for both male and female students, such as swimming, golf and tennis.
Three programs are specifically for men #8213; football, baseball and wrestling #8213; and three athletic programs are specifically for women #8213; softball, volleyball and cheerleading.
“Those three (for each gender) balance each other out,” Rivera said. “If we add ninth-grade baseball, in order to be compliant with Title IX, we must add a female sport, because otherwise we’d get out of balance.”
While Scamihorn encouraged the board to continue thinking “outside the box” in case there was another way to make the program work in the future, he said he supported the committee’s report opposing the addition of a ninth-grade baseball program.
The committee charged with looking into the possibility of adding a ninth-grade baseball program included: Assistant Superintendent of High Schools Kevin Daniel; Executive Director of Employment Kevin Kiger; Halftime Athletics Director Steve Jones; Sherri Thoroughman, assistant principal and athletics director at Hillgrove High School; Kell High School assistant principal Robert Horn; Allatoona High School principal John Kelly; Pope High School principal Robert Downs; and McEachern High School principal Regina Montgomery.
Read more: The Marietta Daily Journal - 9th grade baseball rejected for Cobb schools |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2015 : 13:20:20
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I don't remember the exact numbers, I want to say 22 Varsity and 13-15 JV players at my son's (Cobb County) school. They really didn't have the depth to field a third team. Most of the Freshmen got a lot of PT. If the 4-5 best Freshmen played JV or even Varsity, the Freshman team wouldn't have been very good.
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CaCO3Girl
1989 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2015 : 13:26:15
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| Why can't they add a Freshman Softball team? That would solve the title IX problem. As for funds, well they don't call them FUNDraisers for nothing! |
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BaseballMom6
233 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2015 : 20:48:35
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| I think their argument of having to add a sport for girls due to title IX is incorrect. An additional sport is not being added, it would simply be another team to allow more students to participate. The problem I see is the fluctuation in the numbers of students who come out for the teams. So some years you have enough quality players and other years you do not. At our HS there are currently 6 different cheer squads throughout the year, football, basketball, and competition. That alone ensures there are at least as many teams available for girls as boys. I think it is absurd that the Cobb schools support/allow Freshman football and basketball, but refuse to allow freshman baseball. |
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Shut Out
512 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2015 : 11:47:08
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If your freshman doesn't make the JV they have to look at them self in the mirror and make a tough choice. 1. bust your butt to get better and make it next year. 2. go play in a rec league and have a blast 3. go be a regular kid find other activities to concentrate on.
Life isn't fair and HS is a good place to learn a lesson that not everyone gets a trophy.... |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2015 : 14:30:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Shut Out
If your freshman doesn't make the JV they have to look at them self in the mirror and make a tough choice. 1. bust your butt to get better and make it next year. 2. go play in a rec league and have a blast 3. go be a regular kid find other activities to concentrate on.
Life isn't fair and HS is a good place to learn a lesson that not everyone gets a trophy....
Yeah, but what really happens is that most teams will carry larger JV rosters to keep kids in the program because they show some level of promise of making varsity by their Jr Year. Coaches would rather do this than lose them altogether if they may grow to be a contributor over the next two years. Then you end up with disgruntled parents and players who rarely see the field for game action.
I don't disagree with your take on it, however the reality of what is happening is more akin to what I describe above. It isn't about everyone getting a trophy and life being fair, but if you can keep 15-16 on JV and share playing time, and another 15-16 on Freshman, you get much more playing time for both squads who are busting their tails for a chance to make varsity vs carrying freshman on JV with a 25 player roster and little chance of getting to play.
Apply what pro ball does. Multiple levels of minor league available to develop the talent. Not a AAA team with a roster of 150 players.
Many other counties around Metro Atlanta have Freshman teams for this very reason. You'll still have freshmen who make varsity in these schools, but it provides a viable option for coaches to develop and grow their program in a much more accommodating environment. |
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Shut Out
512 Posts |
Posted - 09/11/2015 : 10:52:16
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Makes sense in a long range plan but the reality is the varsity coaches barely care at all about the JV programs and aren't in favor of have freshman teams. From what I hear is there isn't one cobb varsity coach that was supporting the call to add freshman baseball teams.
quote:
Originally posted by in_the_know
quote:
Originally posted by Shut Out
If your freshman doesn't make the JV they have to look at them self in the mirror and make a tough choice. 1. bust your butt to get better and make it next year. 2. go play in a rec league and have a blast 3. go be a regular kid find other activities to concentrate on.
Life isn't fair and HS is a good place to learn a lesson that not everyone gets a trophy....
Yeah, but what really happens is that most teams will carry larger JV rosters to keep kids in the program because they show some level of promise of making varsity by their Jr Year. Coaches would rather do this than lose them altogether if they may grow to be a contributor over the next two years. Then you end up with disgruntled parents and players who rarely see the field for game action.
I don't disagree with your take on it, however the reality of what is happening is more akin to what I describe above. It isn't about everyone getting a trophy and life being fair, but if you can keep 15-16 on JV and share playing time, and another 15-16 on Freshman, you get much more playing time for both squads who are busting their tails for a chance to make varsity vs carrying freshman on JV with a 25 player roster and little chance of getting to play.
Apply what pro ball does. Multiple levels of minor league available to develop the talent. Not a AAA team with a roster of 150 players.
Many other counties around Metro Atlanta have Freshman teams for this very reason. You'll still have freshmen who make varsity in these schools, but it provides a viable option for coaches to develop and grow their program in a much more accommodating environment.
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 09/11/2015 : 13:03:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Shut Out
From what I hear is there isn't one cobb varsity coach that was supporting the call to add freshman baseball teams.
I know of one who was in complete support, I'm sure there were more based on my discussion with the one, so not sure who you were hearing that from, but certainly not true. All irrelevant at this point since the decision is made.
I do agree that Varsity HC's primary focus is on Varsity, but they are constantly discussing the progress of kids in the pipeline, and many set the starting rosters and call the pitching rotation for their JV programs and have the JV coaches execute it.
I know my son's Varsity roster last year had three kids who had played Varsity as Freshmen, so every other player, including 6 starters, all came up through JV. I believe that the Varsity coaches care pretty strongly about JV since the majority of their future roster started there. |
Edited by - in_the_know on 09/11/2015 13:51:05 |
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stealyourbase
81 Posts |
Posted - 09/11/2015 : 17:20:01
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| Let's not forget that the larger the roster is on JV the more money is being put into the program/school. Baseball does not generate enough revenue for the school as baseball and in some some schools that basketball does to be added. How many would show up to freshman baseball games compared to freshman football or basketball games? |
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in_the_know
985 Posts |
Posted - 09/13/2015 : 11:14:18
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quote:
Originally posted by stealyourbase
Let's not forget that the larger the roster is on JV the more money is being put into the program/school. Baseball does not generate enough revenue for the school as baseball and in some some schools that basketball does to be added. How many would show up to freshman baseball games compared to freshman football or basketball games?
The only people going to JV and Freshman games are the families/girlfriends anyway. So if you assumed you had a 25 player JV roster or a 15 player JV and 15 player Freshman roster, you wouldn't really see much of any difference on the money generated (IMHO). |
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BaseballMom6
233 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2015 : 09:39:04
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They money generated is from fundraisers and Booster club membership. The more players, more money. My son's school does a fall fundraiser/raffle and a golf tournament fundraiser that all players that are "trying out" are expected to participate in. That means you have about 60 players out there raising money before the teams are even selected. The ticket sales for games in negligible in regards to money made for the program.
In the know - 5 extra players selling raffle tickets at the expected sales of $250/player is an easy $1250 more to the program, and that's just one fundraiser. |
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C. MORTON
1051 Posts |
Posted - 09/28/2015 : 17:03:34
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| With all the travel baseball in that area why would one worry about playing 9h grade or JV??? I can probably understand Varsity, but JV?? |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 09/29/2015 : 08:56:40
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quote:
Originally posted by C. MORTON
With all the travel baseball in that area why would one worry about playing 9h grade or JV??? I can probably understand Varsity, but JV??
Because Freshmen don't play travel ball when the High School season is going on. If they don't make the school JV team, there isn't a lot going on until the JV teams are done in late April/early May. Some of the Cobb schools may have enough talent to have both a JV and a Freshman team some years, but mostly not. imho
Except for the studs that made Varsity as Freshmen, I'm not aware of any varsity players that didn't play JV at my son's school, so I'm not sure what you mean by why you would worry about playing JV. |
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lowandoutside
69 Posts |
Posted - 09/29/2015 : 10:34:55
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| Looking at the rosters for several of the JV teams, it appears to be a 50/50 split of sophomores and freshman. Though, some schools do have a higher percentage for freshmen while others have a higher percentage of sophomores. Most schools also have several sophomores on their varsity squad. So, overall, there are more sophomores playing high school ball than freshmen. I'm sure most schools could field a freshmen team without having any issues. The "studs" at the freshmen level would of course join the JV team. But, you could easily fill out a freshmen team. Are all the players going to play at the JV, absolutely not. But, having a freshmen team would put the players in the pipeline, they would start learning their respective school's "way", and it would give them an opportunity to show what they have to the coaching staff. I believe that on the field performance is the best way to judge a player. If there were freshmen teams, a player could play on it and excel and impress the coaching staff and earn a position on the JV team. The same player may walk into a tryout for a JV team, since there are no freshmen teams, and not catch the eye of the coaches. While another player may light up the tryout but not perform well in games. I think we've all been on teams and have seen kids rake and make ESPN top 10 plays in the field during a tryout and never see anything like it again when you start playing and the games count. And, we've all seen the kid who during tryouts you think "really, that kid" and they end up batting at the top of the lineup and playing every inning. Overall, I think most Cobb schools have enough kids to fill out a freshmen team. I wish it would have been left up to the schools to field a team and provide funding if the county wouldn't support the teams. |
Edited by - lowandoutside on 09/29/2015 11:07:30 |
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C. MORTON
1051 Posts |
Posted - 09/29/2015 : 12:52:32
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quote:
Originally posted by AllStar
quote:
Originally posted by C. MORTON
With all the travel baseball in that area why would one worry about playing 9h grade or JV??? I can probably understand Varsity, but JV??
Because Freshmen don't play travel ball when the High School season is going on. If they don't make the school JV team, there isn't a lot going on until the JV teams are done in late April/early May. Some of the Cobb schools may have enough talent to have both a JV and a Freshman team some years, but mostly not. imho
Except for the studs that made Varsity as Freshmen, I'm not aware of any varsity players that didn't play JV at my son's school, so I'm not sure what you mean by why you would worry about playing JV.
Well maybe someone should talk to the travel ball ipowers that be and get them to have freshman teams.. |
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AllStar
762 Posts |
Posted - 09/30/2015 : 12:34:02
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quote:
Originally posted by C. MORTON
quote:
Originally posted by AllStar
quote:
Originally posted by C. MORTON
With all the travel baseball in that area why would one worry about playing 9h grade or JV??? I can probably understand Varsity, but JV??
Because Freshmen don't play travel ball when the High School season is going on. If they don't make the school JV team, there isn't a lot going on until the JV teams are done in late April/early May. Some of the Cobb schools may have enough talent to have both a JV and a Freshman team some years, but mostly not. imho
Except for the studs that made Varsity as Freshmen, I'm not aware of any varsity players that didn't play JV at my son's school, so I'm not sure what you mean by why you would worry about playing JV.
Well maybe someone should talk to the travel ball ipowers that be and get them to have freshman teams..
I've been hearing how high school is going to be replaced by travel since my son started playing travel and he's in his second year in college now. I haven't heard anything about Southern Prospects lately. Is that still an alternative? |
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Cobb Board Denies Freshman HS Baseball
