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HITANDRUN
436 Posts |
 Posted - 08/14/2008 : 15:37:00
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| Before you answer check up on some of the latest data out there. I would assume ice because that is what we always did and what you see most doing today. I have been reading lately where they say don't ice. I would love some insight into this. Pronate what is Dr. Marshall's views on this. |
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tfb
34 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2008 : 16:14:34
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| My son's 13U team had the pleasure of a Marietta native named Kwon visit the team last spring. He is pitching AA for the Detroit Tigers. We asked him this question - he said some pitchers ice and some pitchers actually exercise more after pitching - either running or push ups. He said this helps to remove the free radicals from the pitching arm. |
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HITANDRUN
436 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2008 : 12:40:35
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| I have been hearing that the ice restricts blood flow which to me would keep swelling or trauma down, some say you need blood flow to promote healing? I wonder what the pros think, doctors/trainers and players. |
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Pronate
156 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2008 : 16:48:02
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Hit:
I suspect Dr Marshall would start by saying that if you feel the need to ice then you are either pitching with the traditional pitching motion or you have not completed his interval training programs. 
I think we should start by eliminating heat from the discussion. The idea when trying to recuperate from the micro traumas of pitching is to PROMOTE blood flow. Heating restricts blood flow so I recommend you stay away from heat treatments.
Icing (Cold Induced Vaso Dilation) is probably the best way to PASSIVELY promote blood flow to specific areas (e.g., elbow).
Now to your question of whether ice restrics blood flow. When we initially apply ice, because the body likes to maintain its core temperature, blood flow is restricted to the iced area. But because tissue can't survive without blood flow, the body sends a signal (called Reactive Hyperemia) to the brain to bring on the blood. So blood rushes in (you will note the redness of the skin) and, hopefully, flushes away all signs of the traditional pitching motion. The pain sensation you feel when icing is this Reactive Hyperemia. You should ice for another 20 minutes after the pain sensation.
When you ice you should place the ice in a plastic bag and place the ice directly on the skin. You should not place ice on a t shirt as I see often.
Some people recommend jogging after pitching. (Whatever happened to the days when East Cobb kids would do poles in the outfield during the summer games?) This is called ACTIVE blood flow.
I like both ways so I guess it's up to the individual. In any event, I would prefer that coaches not impose one way or the other.
e
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HITANDRUN
436 Posts |
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Gold Glove
129 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2008 : 00:58:56
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quote:
Originally posted by HITANDRUN
Why do you say "Heating restricts blood flow"
Why does jogging produce active blood flow? How can heat reduce blood flow?
From everything I read Heat increses blood flow.
http://www.sportsinjurybulletin.com/archive/cold-therapy.html
Applying heat creates the exact opposite effect of applying ice, once the body realizes how warm it is, less blood flows to the site. Active blood flow is created by increasing your heart ratye, thus increasing blood flow.
Please be careful putting ice directly on the skin, as I have a nice ice burn on my shoulder as we speak. |
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Pronate
156 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2008 : 02:48:12
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Hit:
My source for "Heating Restricting Blood flow is Dr Charles Beach at Keene State University. I know Dr Beach used a microscope to view the involved tissues after applying heat.
Jogging produces active blood flow because you are moving. When pitchers warm up, for example, before a game, the brain sends a signal to send more blood to the arm. Icing is passive blood flow because you aren't moving. It is the ice that gets the blood flow to the iced area. It is blood that brings nutrients and removes waste products. I don't give a lot of credence to your link but it does demonstrate how difficult it is for parents and coaches to figure out who's right and who's wrong. I think the key thing to understand is that you do not want to be constricting blood flow.
I suppose to be precise I should say that pitchers should do some warm down throwing after high intensity game pitching. I think, however, that jogging is sufficient as well.
The key point to understand is that there never should be a need to ice in the first place. If there is pain during or after pitching it is the bodies way of saying it can't handle the stress. In that case the pitcher has a flaw in his force application technique and/or is not sufficiently trained. For me the short term remedy is ice. The long term remedy is learning how to pitch/train properly.
e
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Edited by - Pronate on 08/19/2008 08:07:16 |
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Should Pitchers Ice or Heat after throwing?
