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| LeftyBat |
Posted - 02/25/2010 : 15:38:04
Due to a coach not to be named and the current reclassification of teams, my son is now playing AA ball when he has played Major classification for last 4 years and contributed at a high level.
I am trying to make sense of the rules (never had to worry about them before) and its not that intuitive. Maybe someone could explain in baseball language what our options are later this spring.
Its pretty clear that my sons team is going to qualify for a state or world series at the AA level that we are being FORCED to play at by USSSA. They may be allowed to move back up where they belong to AAA and also qualify there. As I see the team shedule, there appears to be no intent on his teams part to play in the sub state or state tournament with USSSA. Our last tournament may very well end on June 8. It's likely a Major team will want to pick up my son at the end of the season and that my son will want to play. What are the rules? If the coach disbands the team for USSSA purposes prior to sub states and states, is he allowed to be released? If so, I would assume he is eligible to be picked up as one of the three roster additions that frozen teams are allowed to use? What is the procedure for releasing my son from a frozen AA or AAA roster so he may play for a Major team late in the season?
Secondly, he has just this weekend already been asked to guest play by a team short on players. (we are not playing in a tournament. His coach says he can't be on two rosters at once. Neither teams roster is frozen. Can he play on as many rosters as he wants even if the teams have not qualified (assuming the coach makes sure to appropriately add him to a roster prior to the start of an event...) and is there a time when he cannot do this, even if the teams have not qualified and frozen their rosters.
Thanks in advance for any insight |
| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Alter-Ego |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 21:19:03
Some teams just concentrate on getting the berth, and worry about what 3 players to pick up for the elite, later. The reality is, there are enough good players out there who's team will not qualify for the Elite, that will be available for pick-up. The only caveat is their original team has to release them and they cannot go back to the team for the remainder of the season. Most teams are finished by that time, so that is not typically an issue. |
| LeftyBat |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 17:51:08
quote:
Originally posted by ljames
I agree. If this was the case the core of your team better be strong.
yes, but your would generally already need to have a strong core if you were good enough to be on the edge of earning a berth to the Elite, but just needing a couple of studs to get over the top... Once have the berth, then replacing the studs that helped you get there with new ones with the three roster additions you are allowed with the frozen roster should not be a problem.
Just run an add on this site or the other site we all frequent but I won't name here and your phone will ring.... |
| ljames |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 14:23:24
I agree. If this was the case the core of your team better be strong. |
| LeftyBat |
Posted - 02/27/2010 : 20:05:34
quote:
Originally posted by ljames
quote:
Thank you everyone who posted with information. That was helpful.
After reading the things posted, a couple of things come to mind.
First, are there restrictions or rules regarding a coach with a frozen roster releasing a player or is he free to do it at will for any reason. It would seem to me that this would allow coaches to "borrow" strong players to qualify for an event, then release the player back to their orginal or any other team after they are in the tourney. Seems very useful if you are trying to qualify for an elite berth. Obviously, the boy they "borrowed" to help them qualify that goes back to his team can not go back and play with the other team once he is released. (but could play with another team...)
Second, if a team qualifies but decides not to play in a state or sub state or world series, obviously they forfeit their eligibility to compete in the world series. Is the roster then considered disbanded for the year and all of those players are released or does the coach need to individually release these players so that they are eligible to play with other teams for state and world series tourneys.
Third, it looks as though if my sons team were to earn a berth to states at their first tournament in Mar that he would be prohibited from guest playing with other teams in USSSA until the point where his team was done playing USSSA events (assuming they are not going to states or sub states)
Lastly, it is my understanding that we asked to be moved back up to triple A and play at that level for Slugfest and we were denied that opportunity.
To your first...You are right before the roster is frozen a coach could pick up a couple strong players and earn a berth then immediately release the players. Doesn't make much sense to do this because he is then left with his team that could not qualify without these players or he would need to pick up 3 more 72 hours before the qualifying event
To your second...If the team does not play in the World Series their roster is still active. The coach would have to release players wishing to play post season with other teams.
To your third...You are correct
To your last...This is really up to the discretion of the tournament director. Most will let you play up, but in your case I would bet the AAA classification already has a lot of AAA teams and he gave the spot to them because their only other option is to play up to Major. There are many other tournaments that you can play in that are AAA or Open.
Well for the teams chasing a bid to the Elite, I would think many of them would employ outside players to qualify, even if they would not have them for the event. The bid is hard to get, highly sought after and once you have it, recruiting players is much easier.
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| ljames |
Posted - 02/27/2010 : 11:39:12
quote:
Thank you everyone who posted with information. That was helpful.
After reading the things posted, a couple of things come to mind.
First, are there restrictions or rules regarding a coach with a frozen roster releasing a player or is he free to do it at will for any reason. It would seem to me that this would allow coaches to "borrow" strong players to qualify for an event, then release the player back to their orginal or any other team after they are in the tourney. Seems very useful if you are trying to qualify for an elite berth. Obviously, the boy they "borrowed" to help them qualify that goes back to his team can not go back and play with the other team once he is released. (but could play with another team...)
Second, if a team qualifies but decides not to play in a state or sub state or world series, obviously they forfeit their eligibility to compete in the world series. Is the roster then considered disbanded for the year and all of those players are released or does the coach need to individually release these players so that they are eligible to play with other teams for state and world series tourneys.
Third, it looks as though if my sons team were to earn a berth to states at their first tournament in Mar that he would be prohibited from guest playing with other teams in USSSA until the point where his team was done playing USSSA events (assuming they are not going to states or sub states)
Lastly, it is my understanding that we asked to be moved back up to triple A and play at that level for Slugfest and we were denied that opportunity.
To your first...You are right before the roster is frozen a coach could pick up a couple strong players and earn a berth then immediately release the players. Doesn't make much sense to do this because he is then left with his team that could not qualify without these players or he would need to pick up 3 more 72 hours before the qualifying event
To your second...If the team does not play in the World Series their roster is still active. The coach would have to release players wishing to play post season with other teams.
To your third...You are correct
To your last...This is really up to the discretion of the tournament director. Most will let you play up, but in your case I would bet the AAA classification already has a lot of AAA teams and he gave the spot to them because their only other option is to play up to Major. There are many other tournaments that you can play in that are AAA or Open. |
| Alter-Ego |
Posted - 02/26/2010 : 23:54:24
A coach, with a frozen roster, can release a player, for any reason, but is unable to pick that player back up the remainder of the season. |
| LeftyBat |
Posted - 02/26/2010 : 11:31:37
quote:
Originally posted by whits23
the team classes the player not vice versa..you can always as a team play up or open..you dont have to play AA if you want to play higher. And as its been covered over and over you can be on as many rosters as you like until frozen. Just cant play more than one team in same tourney
Thank you everyone who posted with information. That was helpful.
After reading the things posted, a couple of things come to mind.
First, are there restrictions or rules regarding a coach with a frozen roster releasing a player or is he free to do it at will for any reason. It would seem to me that this would allow coaches to "borrow" strong players to qualify for an event, then release the player back to their orginal or any other team after they are in the tourney. Seems very useful if you are trying to qualify for an elite berth. Obviously, the boy they "borrowed" to help them qualify that goes back to his team can not go back and play with the other team once he is released. (but could play with another team...)
Second, if a team qualifies but decides not to play in a state or sub state or world series, obviously they forfeit their eligibility to compete in the world series. Is the roster then considered disbanded for the year and all of those players are released or does the coach need to individually release these players so that they are eligible to play with other teams for state and world series tourneys.
Third, it looks as though if my sons team were to earn a berth to states at their first tournament in Mar that he would be prohibited from guest playing with other teams in USSSA until the point where his team was done playing USSSA events (assuming they are not going to states or sub states)
Lastly, it is my understanding that we asked to be moved back up to triple A and play at that level for Slugfest and we were denied that opportunity. |
| whits23 |
Posted - 02/25/2010 : 20:56:47
the team classes the player not vice versa..you can always as a team play up or open..you dont have to play AA if you want to play higher. And as its been covered over and over you can be on as many rosters as you like until frozen. Just cant play more than one team in same tourney |
| ljames |
Posted - 02/25/2010 : 19:01:41
If your son’s team plans to attempt to qualify and play in a USSSA World Series they will have to play in the Sub State and if qualified State.
7.03 All teams receiving berths to World Series shall participate in their (home) state’s State Championship provided such a State
Championship is played. Failure to participate in the State Championship if played shall result in forfeiture of the World Series
berth.
Rule 7.03 Comment: State Directors shall have the authority to waive this rule with approval of the Association’s Executive
Vice President of Baseball.
You can do this at the AA level and if bumped to AAA the World Series berth changes over to AAA. This happened to my team a couple of year’s back which forced us to cancel the USSSA World Series event all together due to the AA and AAA World Series dates being different. They bumped us in May and parents had already scheduled vacation time for the previous classification dates. It was a BIG mess and USSSA only said that our winning percentage and power ranking were too good and we had to be moved up.
If his current team’s roster never becomes frozen he can be added to another team before post season play without problem.
3.08.A Team managers shall be allowed to add a maximum of three (3) players to their frozen Official Online Roster.
Players may be added as late as seventy-two (72) hours prior to the start of the World Series. Additional players
can only be added to rosters that have openings pursuant to USSSA Rules 3.06.C & 3.06.D.
If the team you play with this weekend qualifies and roster becomes frozen (be mindful you don’t have to win the tournament) your son will be tied to that team if not released. If this is the case and he is released he can not go back to that team this season.
3.07.B When a team qualifies all players on the team’s Official Online Roster become frozen to the qualified team (unless
released pursuant to these rules) and shall be bound to the qualified team up to and including the teams respective
State Championship and / or World Series. No player shall appear on any other team’s frozen or unfrozen Official
Online Roster within the same age division regardless of classification .
3.08.C There shall be no limit to the number of players team managers may release from their frozen Official Online
Roster. A player released from a team’s frozen Official Online Roster shall be prohibited from returning to that
team during the current season.
So as long as no roster if frozen according to USSSA rules you can be on as many as you’d like. Just be careful when rosters get frozen.
3.05 Player Roster Eligibility –
3.05.A PRIOR TO BEING FROZEN TO AN OFFICIAL ONLINE ROSTER;
3.05.A.1 Players shall be permitted to participate with multiple teams in the same age division.
3.05.A.2 Players shall only physically play for one (1) team per day, event, tournament, week or weekend,
regardless of age division and / or classification.
3.05.B AFTER BEING FROZEN TO AN OFFICIAL ONLINE ROSTER;
3.05.B.1 Players shall only appear on one (1) Official Online Roster per age division and shall only participate
with such frozen team (unless previously released pursuant to these rules).
3.05.B.2 Players participating in multiple age divisions shall only appear on one (1) Official Online Roster per
age division and shall only participate with such frozen team(s) (unless previously released pursuant
to these rules) but shall not participate on any team below the classification of the oldest team in
which they participate on.
3.05.B.3 Players shall only physically play for one (1) team per day, event, tournament, week or weekend,
regardless of age division and / or classification. |
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