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| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| bbmom2 |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 17:45:27
We've gone back and forth over moving to another area for a high school baseball team - perceived better program. In discussing it more this weekend the question arose - does it really matter where our son plays high school ball? Is it more important now to be on a good travel ball team as he moves up into those High School years? If he does desire or has the talent to go to college ball, or perhaps further, does where he play high school ball really matter or is it more of a right of passage and thing to do? Is it more important to play in the perfect game and other showcases? Do college scouts even go to high school games anymore? Do high school coaches help their players (as some HS football coaches do?) If I were asking this question 15 years ago or even living in another state, the question wouldn't have even occurred to us, but in this area? There are other reasons to move but this one is up for discussion as to is it a true reason,
I trust I will get many, many different answers from this forum so getting out my popcorn and settling in.... |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| baseballparentof2 |
Posted - 08/26/2011 : 22:42:34
quote:
Originally posted by teddy41
Regarding this comment
My son received a college baseball scholarship this year without ever making his high school team or playing one season of travel ball
I would like to know more about what school, how you did it. how much scholoarship.
my only complaint with HS is its almost no fun till playoffs then they are over in a month
It is a division II state university in another state. He had a "coach" that really recruited for him. He called numerous coaches, set up workouts, etc. He is a pitcher only and my husband drove him to meet this coach while he was in Georgia and had a mini tryout. And that was that. Was it school we would have looked at before that? Probably not, but if he can get an education (with little money out of pocket- you need to have GOOD grades so you can qualify for an academic scholarship also) and play some ball then GREAT! I hope he can atleast stick it out for 2 years and if he can keep the scholarship for all 4 years then even better.
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| teddy41 |
Posted - 08/26/2011 : 14:34:00
Regarding this comment
My son received a college baseball scholarship this year without ever making his high school team or playing one season of travel ball
I would like to know more about what school, how you did it. how much scholoarship.
my only complaint with HS is its almost no fun till playoffs then they are over in a month |
| BaseballMomof2 |
Posted - 08/24/2011 : 11:03:58
My two cents worth on the subject:
bbmom2, if you are planning a move, look for the schools where you child will get the best EDUCATION. HS baseball teams can be cliquey - you are not assured that your son will make the HS team even if you moved to be there. Whether it is your current school or another one, you should be where it is a good all around fit for your family. Education quality and friends who are on the right track should be your first priority.
There were scouts at a few of our HS games this spring. They were there to see one specific player. I think that they were there to see that particular kid because he had been on their radar from previous Perfect Game and showcase tournament experiences. The kids from our HS who are getting the best College offers for baseball are the ones who are playing in the showcases on teams in addition to the HS team. Don't know if other HS coaches allow it, but at our HS, kids play on showcase teams after the spring season is over as long as they are willing to also play on the HS summer team and be available as often as possible for the summer team.
Parents: Your child's talent and attitude are only one part of the equation to getting on the HS baseball team. Volunteer your time for the program. Do whatever you can to help out. Be there when there is work to be done and always keep a positive disposition around the players, the coaches and the other parents. Realize that there are likely already enough "chiefs" in the program and worker bees are what is needed when you are trying to get into a program. Parents, your attitude and disposition can also affect whether your child makes the team. If the coaches are making a decision between your kid and another of equal talent to give a spot to on the team, they will likely consider the attitude and conduct of both player and parents in making their decisions. And yes, fundraising is important and you should be prepared to do your part there also. |
| Take 2 |
Posted - 08/24/2011 : 10:02:08
Many families chose to move due to the Size of the school. Believe it or not, many families move to smaller school systems to secure their kid a spot on the team, with playing time the most important(not school records).
What I've noticed and learned in 2 high school years: Large 5-A schools are looked at heavily, along with private schools that are known to recruit the local talent. However, every baseball team is watched for talent. Local JUCO, NAIA, NCAA Colleges send their players out to watch games. It's one of their team assignments. They just go and watch games and report back to recruits and coaches. They may be assigned to a "team" to follow throughout a pitching rotation (4-5 games) or for a month. As for pro-scouts, they make their rounds to the HS coaches, just to pick their brain on the "up and coming" talent. Participation in your HS program is extremely important, even if they are terrible. College coaches need to see the commitment to the SCHOOL program. When you do not play for your High School College coaches question LOYALTY and COMMITMENT. When you are up against higher GPA's, stats, and friendships you do not need any RED flags. High School Coaches do not have the time to help you with recruiting. They have a few players they will recommend to participate in special programs/games but as for the 15 other kids on the team, they will need to do a little more work.
Like others mentioned, I really like the Perfect Game Tournaments (a scout as each game), Jupiter Qualifiers, and some World Series Qualifiers. These tournaments have scouts all over the place looking at every team no matter the size and cost of the program.
If your 12 or 13 year old has really "GOOD" friends, no trouble and seem to be on the right track, do not move him. There's a lot of wicked "STUFF" out there and if you have a solid foundation, do not mess with it whatsoever.
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| oldmanmj |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 22:46:20
Mom, First and foremost is the going to be the best place for your family. Second, the education your children will receive from the school they will be attending.....last, the quality of the sports at your school. I love to win, never had a losing season in any sport I played or coached, very lucky. High School sports can be a stepping stone, but now it is how well do you market your son to schools. Sadly, scouts don't visit a high school unless there is a phenomenal player coming or at your schoool, hopefully your son some day. Otherwise, your families health, welfare and general improvement are most important. Good Luck and God Bless as you make your search. |
| bbmom2 |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 18:01:46
Some really good points here - thank you everyone. A couple of clarifications - I said "perceived better" because we haven't talked to the coaches and since we have played against player in both HS areas, one has "better players" right now. Growth and desire may change that in the next year. Also, his middle school feeds to both HS so he will still play with his friends no matter which one he goes to. We would not move strictly for the baseball program. We are moving for other reasons, getting out of a congested area and moving closer to work plus the possibility of a family member moving in with us. We were thinking of the baseball team as just one consideration - all things being equal with two different houses, should the baseball team be a consideration?
The posters have brought up points we haven't considered no matter where we play HS ball - assuming he makes it. His intention is to play HS - or at least try out! Fond memories of following my HS baseball team to State and winning. Hope he gets to experience the same.... keep those thoughts coming - enjoying the discussion. |
| HITANDRUN |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 17:40:26
quote:
Originally posted by coachdan06
i like what i read here about pretty much everryone already knowing scouts don't do their work at high school games
in total agreement that those same scouts do NOT care or look serious at anyone under 16 , some say even 17 .
showcase organizers and some team coaches would fast tell you 14 and 15 because of $$ they can profit with it but its not true
16 was the magic number until Bryce Harper. 15 is an age scouts might look at you or might show some interest. Not the norm but possible. 16 definitely. Heck Colleges are looking for verbals by your junior year now.
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| in_the_know |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 15:28:56
The OP's statement was that all things were equal with the exception that one had a "perceived" better program. You outline a stark difference. In my initial response, I suggested that if the coaching difference was significant, then it would be an entirely different discussion. What you pose below is also a completely different discussion. Are you (or your son) interested in only winning? Is he willing to leave his school friends and teammates behind to acheive winning? Would he prefer to abandon his school for greener pasture baseball programs, hence adding to the problem, or would he rather stick with his school and be part of the solution?
Again, you pose an entirely different question than the OP.
quote:
Originally posted by Peanutsr
We live in a district in which the school has a very good football and basketball program yet their baseball program has gone downhill over the last five to ten years. So much so that they were run ruled on several occasions last season.
We live within a few miles of a school who went to the state championship last year.
My son's only sport is baseball. I am curious as to all the posters who stated that it is ridiculous to change schools for baseball. If your child was in a similar situation, would you still feel that way?
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| Peanutsr |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 13:28:06
We live in a district in which the school has a very good football and basketball program yet their baseball program has gone downhill over the last five to ten years. So much so that they were run ruled on several occasions last season.
We live within a few miles of a school who went to the state championship last year.
My son's only sport is baseball. I am curious as to all the posters who stated that it is ridiculous to change schools for baseball. If your child was in a similar situation, would you still feel that way? |
| coachdan06 |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 11:12:00
i like what i read here about pretty much everryone already knowing scouts don't do their work at high school games
in total agreement that those same scouts do NOT care or look serious at anyone under 16 , some say even 17 .
showcase organizers and some team coaches would fast tell you 14 and 15 because of $$ they can profit with it but its not true
now to change high schools to somehow improve your chances at college baseball or even worse to just be able to even make the team ,well that is total off the chain and a bad message : if your son is good enough then nothing needs to be changed , right ? |
| HITANDRUN |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 11:05:13
I agree with most everything said here. There is pride in playing with your high school team, that can't be matched with a travel team. Can you get drafted or a College Scholarship without playing HS? sure.
If your high school coach has contacts he can make it easier to get on a college with one verbal recommendation. Attending showcases at Colleges is expensive but probably the best way to get a look if you can afford it and can do something to stand out from the rest. Perfect Game and WWBC games are also good ways. |
| JCB |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 10:46:34
Most of what everyone is saying is correct, but isn't it a shame that HS coaches do not do more or the system is now so flawed as to make the recruiting process mostly a travel ball phenomena. I believe that is a result of the proliferation and commericalization of travel baseball. Schools don't have the resources to compete with the profit seeking organizatins that are controlling travel baseball and recruiting. If you disagree all you needed to see was the 180 kids that payed $600 this past weekend at PG's Showcase. I sure did not see that many scouts present, certainly not enough or enough from the varying types of schools that would be recruiting the majority of the playes that paid the fee. Maybe in our day and time we have no choice but to participate in this recruiting business, but it sure does not feel right. Schools are likely better off protecting the classroom $$ and not the playing fields (that is left to us through these recruiting businesses). |
| bballman |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 08:20:29
I agree with what everyone is saying. Doesn't really matter where you play HS. I think not playing HS will throw up a red flag to college coaches that you better have a good explanation for, but where you play doesn't really matter. There will be a few scouts at HS games, as others have mentioned, but as doc says, they are usually there to see a particular player while they happen to be in the area. If you have a total stud on your team, you may get their college coach or a pro scout or two to come by to a game, but most of the recruiting is done during the summer. Get on a good summer travel game that does the PG events and goes to various college workouts. That is where you will be seen. Just let your son have fun and play with his friends in HS. |
| oldmanmj |
Posted - 08/23/2011 : 08:04:58
THere is great fun in playing HS baseball, and if your team is good enough to make it to State, that is great also. Generally speaking, it is not a good thing to switch schools. I don't think we are teaching kids the right message hopping from one team to another because we aren't happy. School changes are even more taxing. Just like an adult, somtimes we just have to suck it up. Put your head down, and work you butt off anyway. Do we quit every job we have because we don't like a manager, the owner or a co-worker? Sometimes, if it is absolutely unbearable, otherwise we weigh the consequences of move on. HS Sports aren't life or death and sadly most HS coaches can't give you what you want or need for getting better. It is what it is. Stay put unless the coach is just horrific as a human being. |
| Dr. Old School |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 22:14:11
I believe playing at HS is more about the pride of playing for your school, and representing those students you go to class with every day. There are cases when scouts will go to see a kid at their HS game, but typically they have already seen them at one of the Perfect Game tournaments or showcases. Local area scouts might run to see a player if they are playing close to where they live, but most don't have the budget to run all over the countryside looking at one player at a time. They get more for their money at the WWBA tournaments or at the PG Showcases.
Football differs in that there is not travel Football for scouts to see players play. There are camps that players will go to, but players rely on help from HS coaches in getting connected more than Baseball.
Don't get me wrong, there are some really good HS coaches that are more than happy to help players get connected. Many of them have connections with several schools. Also, don't discount the emotion of playing for your school team and the pride that goes with it. |
| in_the_know |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 21:44:42
From someone who's been there, it doesn't really matter where he plays HS. If he has the talent, he will be found given the multitude of marketing options and resources available in our area. The part that separates HS ball from travel ball for my son is that on the HS team he gets to play on a team with his friends and builds a comradary with the same kids that he's in school with, going to football games with and has been hanging out with since elementary school. If we were to move away from that to put him in a different HS for the sole purpose of finding a different or better team, then we'd defeat the allure of HS baseball for him.
That said, I am assuming that coaching is equal in both situations for you. If you have a terrible coach at one school and are seeking a different coaching environment, then that's a different conversation entirely.
quote:
Originally posted by bbmom2
We've gone back and forth over moving to another area for a high school baseball team - perceived better program. In discussing it more this weekend the question arose - does it really matter where our son plays high school ball? Is it more important now to be on a good travel ball team as he moves up into those High School years? If he does desire or has the talent to go to college ball, or perhaps further, does where he play high school ball really matter or is it more of a right of passage and thing to do? Is it more important to play in the perfect game and other showcases? Do college scouts even go to high school games anymore? Do high school coaches help their players (as some HS football coaches do?) If I were asking this question 15 years ago or even living in another state, the question wouldn't have even occurred to us, but in this area? There are other reasons to move but this one is up for discussion as to is it a true reason,
I trust I will get many, many different answers from this forum so getting out my popcorn and settling in....
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| a1prog |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 21:42:44
The short answer is- high school ball matters little if at all in terms of the recruiting process. I have been to many high school games (from 1a to 5a) and seeing a college scout at them is rare. In fact, you are more likely to see a pro scout than you are a college one. why? because college baseball programs and high school teams play at the same time and the colleges have budgets that are much more limited than say football or hoops in terms of travel expenses and the coaches who do recruiting.
college coaches will absolutely come and watch summer ball- in particular at the perfect game events starting at age 16. at the 18u and 17u PG events there are a ton of colleges coming to look.
where high school does matter is this- a college coach will call the high school coach as a reference check. he will ask about skill level but the truth is the college guy has already seen that during the summer. what he really wants from the hs coach is info about character, work ethic and the "other stuff" that goes into the decision. so, while the program at your local hs is not paramount who your coach is can be a big deal because if your coach is a class A prick then he has the ability to hurt your kid in the recruiting process (yes this does occur).
hope this helps. |
| baseballparentof2 |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 21:33:21
If your son's goal is to play college ball, you need to be the one contacting the college coaches, sending videos, etc and not waiting on a college scout to see him.
My son received a college baseball scholarship this year without ever making his high school team or playing one season of travel ball. It can be done but you must be the one doing the recruiting. So in my opinion it really doesn't matter where you play. |
| AllStar |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 20:43:40
All my son has cared about since he was about 8 is playing for his High School team. He couldn't care less if there are scouts there, if there's a 12 year-old who can throw harder than him, if his travel teams only win one tournament a year and are usually just north or just south of .500, every Spring for 4 years he wants to play for his High School.
If playing college is meant to be, it will be there. Not even on the radar right now. And no, we wouldn't move just for baseball. |
| bmoser |
Posted - 08/22/2011 : 20:42:51
I can only answer 1 part of your question...College and Pro Scouts DO attend some High School games.
I went to a High School game 2 years ago, North Gwinnett vs. Collins Hill and there were 2 Colleges, 1 unaffiliated floating scout (I met him and he pointed out the others), and 2 pro scouts there watching 1 player from each team. This was AAAAA level High School ball.
the North player was Chris Hawkins. Google his name and you can see he did really well in the Rookie/A level this past Spring. Named one of the top players at this level.
The other was a pitcher from Collins Hill who got signed by Toronto Blue Jays. I don't recall his name. I think he was a lefty.
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